www.digitalmars.com         C & C++   DMDScript  

digitalmars.D - Card on fire

reply Andrei Alexandrescu <SeeWebsiteForEmail erdani.org> writes:
Got a text from Walter - his famous fanless graphics card caught fire 
along with the motherboard. He'll be outta commission for a few days. -- 
Andrei
Jul 09 2016
next sibling parent reply A.B <A.B aaaabbbb.sdf.vr> writes:
On Sunday, 10 July 2016 at 02:43:42 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu 
wrote:

 Got a text from Walter - his famous fanless graphics card 
 caught fire along with the motherboard. He'll be outta 
 commission for a few days. -- Andrei


lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOErZuzZpS8
Jul 09 2016
next sibling parent reply Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/9/2016 9:11 PM, A.B wrote:

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOErZuzZpS8


You must be older than me to think of that song!
Jul 11 2016
parent =?UTF-8?Q?Ali_=c3=87ehreli?= <acehreli yahoo.com> writes:
On 07/11/2016 02:11 PM, Walter Bright wrote:

 On 7/9/2016 9:11 PM, A.B wrote:

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOErZuzZpS8


 You must be older than me to think of that song!


Great music! I was thinking how dangerous that show was then I found 
this on Wikipedia:

<quote>
Brown quickly earned a reputation for outlandish performances, which 
included the use of a burning metal helmet, that led to occasional 
mishaps, such as during an early appearance at the Windsor Festival in 
1967, where he wore a colander on his head soaked in methanol. The fuel 
poured over his head by accident and caught fire; a bystander doused the 
flames by pouring beer on Brown's head, preventing any serious 
injury.[6] The flaming head then became an Arthur Brown signature.
</quote>

:D

Ali
Jul 14 2016
prev sibling parent reply =?UTF-8?Q?Ali_=c3=87ehreli?= <acehreli yahoo.com> writes:
On 07/09/2016 09:11 PM, A.B wrote:

 On Sunday, 10 July 2016 at 02:43:42 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:

 Got a text from Walter - his famous fanless graphics card caught fire
 along with the motherboard. He'll be outta commission for a few days.
 -- Andrei


 lol

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOErZuzZpS8


OK, this is really going off off topic but thank you for posting that. 
I've discovered Arthur Brown (you? ;) ). An "under-appreciated treasure" 
indeed... Something new from the 60s once again...

Ali
Jul 14 2016
parent reply Basile B. <b2.temp gmx.com> writes:
On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 00:17:35 UTC, Ali Çehreli wrote:

 On 07/09/2016 09:11 PM, A.B wrote:

 On Sunday, 10 July 2016 at 02:43:42 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu 
 wrote:

 Got a text from Walter - his famous fanless graphics card 
 caught fire
 along with the motherboard. He'll be outta commission for a 
 few days.
 -- Andrei


 lol

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOErZuzZpS8


 OK, this is really going off off topic but thank you for 
 posting that. I've discovered Arthur Brown (you? ;) ). An 
 "under-appreciated treasure" indeed... Something new from the 
 60s once again...

 Ali


Actually it was me, I often use some stupid pseudos (or confusing 
ones) on the forum, espacially after beer.

This makes me think that there is also "under-appreciated 
treasures" of the same times in your origin country (turkie right 
?), I think that you should know all the "Anatolyan rock" wave. 
Some of the stuff were truely awesome.
Jul 14 2016
parent reply =?UTF-8?Q?Ali_=c3=87ehreli?= <acehreli yahoo.com> writes:
On 07/14/2016 09:18 PM, Basile B. wrote:

 On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 00:17:35 UTC, Ali Çehreli wrote:



 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOErZuzZpS8


 OK, this is really going off off topic but thank you for posting that.
 I've discovered Arthur Brown (you? ;) ). An "under-appreciated
 treasure" indeed... Something new from the 60s once again...





 This makes me think that there is also "under-appreciated treasures" of
 the same times in your origin country (turkie right ?), I think that you
 should know all the "Anatolyan rock" wave. Some of the stuff were truely
 awesome.


I was too young to appreciate at the time but apparently the sound track 
and the whole aesthetics of the 60s are trapped inside my cells. :)

The amazing group Replikas has recently recorded some of the songs from 
the Anatolian Rock era:

   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biz_Burada_Yok_%C4%B0ken

I think I love Replikas because they seem to make music for themselves.

Ali
Jul 15 2016
parent reply Basile B. <b2.temp gmx.com> writes:
On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 21:03:28 UTC, Ali Çehreli wrote:

 On 07/14/2016 09:18 PM, Basile B. wrote:

 [...]



 [...]




 posting that.

 [...]




 "under-appreciated

 [...]





 [...]


 treasures" of

 [...]


 think that you

 [...]


 were truely

 [...]


 I was too young to appreciate at the time but apparently the 
 sound track and the whole aesthetics of the 60s are trapped 
 inside my cells. :)

 The amazing group Replikas has recently recorded some of the 
 songs from the Anatolian Rock era:

   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biz_Burada_Yok_%C4%B0ken

 I think I love Replikas because they seem to make music for 
 themselves.

 Ali


 From the few I know i retain this one

     https://youtu.be/Fn8ZfjBsrng?t=23m19s

very hooking.
Jul 16 2016
next sibling parent Basile B. <b2.temp gmx.com> writes:
On Saturday, 16 July 2016 at 07:57:20 UTC, Basile B. wrote:

 On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 21:03:28 UTC, Ali Çehreli wrote:

 On 07/14/2016 09:18 PM, Basile B. wrote:

 [...]



 [...]




 posting that.

 [...]




 "under-appreciated

 [...]





 [...]


 treasures" of

 [...]


 think that you

 [...]


 were truely

 [...]


 I was too young to appreciate at the time but apparently the 
 sound track and the whole aesthetics of the 60s are trapped 
 inside my cells. :)

 The amazing group Replikas has recently recorded some of the 
 songs from the Anatolian Rock era:

   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biz_Burada_Yok_%C4%B0ken

 I think I love Replikas because they seem to make music for 
 themselves.

 Ali


 From the few I know i retain this one

     https://youtu.be/Fn8ZfjBsrng?t=23m19s

 very hooking.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BuQkQEcsm5Y&index=12&list=PLuhnsen8iS5ltHofd21TWBx-bqmR9V8RU&nohtml5=False
Jul 16 2016
prev sibling parent reply =?UTF-8?Q?Ali_=c3=87ehreli?= <acehreli yahoo.com> writes:
On 07/16/2016 12:57 AM, Basile B. wrote:

 On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 21:03:28 UTC, Ali Çehreli wrote:



 The amazing group Replikas





  From the few I know i retain this one

      https://youtu.be/Fn8ZfjBsrng?t=23m19s

 very hooking.


Amazing!

And there is a connection: I recognized "Taş var Köpek Yok" right away 
because Replikas covers that song in the hidden track of one of their 
albums:

   https://www.izlesene.com/video/replikas-reddiye/5805189#t=720

Ok, this sub thread can go on forever but it should end at some point... :)

Ali
Jul 16 2016
parent Basile B. <b2.temp gmx.com> writes:
On Saturday, 16 July 2016 at 12:16:48 UTC, Ali Çehreli wrote:

 On 07/16/2016 12:57 AM, Basile B. wrote:

 On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 21:03:28 UTC, Ali Çehreli wrote:



 The amazing group Replikas





  From the few I know i retain this one

      https://youtu.be/Fn8ZfjBsrng?t=23m19s

 very hooking.


 Amazing!

 And there is a connection: I recognized "Taş var Köpek Yok" 
 right away because Replikas covers that song in the hidden 
 track of one of their albums:

   https://www.izlesene.com/video/replikas-reddiye/5805189#t=720

 Ok, this sub thread can go on forever but it should end at some 
 point... :)

 Ali


I agree. I've used my culture to mock walt...but now it's 
finished...
Jul 16 2016
prev sibling next sibling parent Jack Stouffer <jack jackstouffer.com> writes:
On Sunday, 10 July 2016 at 02:43:42 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu 
wrote:

 Got a text from Walter - his famous fanless graphics card 
 caught fire along with the motherboard. He'll be outta 
 commission for a few days. -- Andrei


Glad he's ok.

Maybe go overboard with the fans this time ;)
Jul 09 2016
prev sibling next sibling parent Mike James <foo bar.com> writes:
On Sunday, 10 July 2016 at 02:43:42 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu 
wrote:

 Got a text from Walter - his famous fanless graphics card 
 caught fire along with the motherboard. He'll be outta 
 commission for a few days. -- Andrei


I hope he wasn't using it on the back of a camel in the desert...

http://forum.dlang.org/post/nl5hqu$1atc$1 digitalmars.com
Jul 11 2016
prev sibling next sibling parent reply Steven Schveighoffer <schveiguy yahoo.com> writes:
On 7/9/16 10:43 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:

 Got a text from Walter - his famous fanless graphics card caught fire
 along with the motherboard. He'll be outta commission for a few days. --


That's kind of scary. It's one of those things you don't think about 
happening -- like what if you weren't home if this happened.

Could have been a lot worse.

-Steve
Jul 11 2016
parent reply Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/11/2016 6:06 AM, Steven Schveighoffer wrote:

 That's kind of scary. It's one of those things you don't think about
 happening -- like what if you weren't home if this happened.

 Could have been a lot worse.


Yeah, I consider myself very lucky, as I leave the machine on all the 
time. I was sitting next to it when it burst into flame, and cutting the 
power put it out. In the future I plan on cutting the time for it to go 
into hibernation. Fortunately it's a metal case that doesn't burn, but 
I'm still thinking about bending some tin to act as baffles over the 
vents, and setting it on a metal plate.
Jul 11 2016
parent reply Jacob Carlborg <doob me.com> writes:
On 2016-07-11 23:23, Walter Bright wrote:


 Yeah, I consider myself very lucky, as I leave the machine on all the
 time. I was sitting next to it when it burst into flame, and cutting the
 power put it out. In the future I plan on cutting the time for it to go
 into hibernation. Fortunately it's a metal case that doesn't burn, but
 I'm still thinking about bending some tin to act as baffles over the
 vents, and setting it on a metal plate.


I put my computer into sleep mode when I'm not using it for a longer 
period of time. It seems to shutdown everything but keeps some power to 
keep the data in RAM alive. So it turn back on instantly.

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg
Jul 11 2016
next sibling parent reply Chris <wendlec tcd.ie> writes:
On Tuesday, 12 July 2016 at 06:24:13 UTC, Jacob Carlborg wrote:

 On 2016-07-11 23:23, Walter Bright wrote:


 Yeah, I consider myself very lucky, as I leave the machine on 
 all the
 time. I was sitting next to it when it burst into flame, and 
 cutting the
 power put it out. In the future I plan on cutting the time for 
 it to go
 into hibernation. Fortunately it's a metal case that doesn't 
 burn, but
 I'm still thinking about bending some tin to act as baffles 
 over the
 vents, and setting it on a metal plate.


 I put my computer into sleep mode when I'm not using it for a 
 longer period of time. It seems to shutdown everything but 
 keeps some power to keep the data in RAM alive. So it turn back 
 on instantly.


I turn it off every day. If the OS is up too long (several days), 
it starts to act weirdly and may crash at the most inconvenient 
time (is there a convenient time for a crash?). All OSes are the 
same in this respect, I think Windows is the worst, but Linux and 
OS X are not much better in this respect. Must be some sort of 
memory pollution.
Jul 12 2016
parent reply Jacob Carlborg <doob me.com> writes:
On 2016-07-12 11:06, Chris wrote:


 I turn it off every day.


Sleep can be convenient if you're going to use it later the same day, 
for example.


 If the OS is up too long (several days), it
 starts to act weirdly and may crash at the most inconvenient time (is
 there a convenient time for a crash?). All OSes are the same in this
 respect, I think Windows is the worst, but Linux and OS X are not much
 better in this respect. Must be some sort of memory pollution.


I use OS X and I don't recognize that problem.

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg
Jul 12 2016
next sibling parent reply Steven Schveighoffer <schveiguy yahoo.com> writes:
On 7/12/16 7:51 AM, Jacob Carlborg wrote:

 On 2016-07-12 11:06, Chris wrote:


 I turn it off every day.


 Sleep can be convenient if you're going to use it later the same day,
 for example.


 If the OS is up too long (several days), it
 starts to act weirdly and may crash at the most inconvenient time (is
 there a convenient time for a crash?). All OSes are the same in this
 respect, I think Windows is the worst, but Linux and OS X are not much
 better in this respect. Must be some sort of memory pollution.


 I use OS X and I don't recognize that problem.


OSX needs a reboot every once in a while. iOS too. In particular, my 
bluetooth system will stop working (and then my trackpad no longer 
works). Yes, I've tried all the resetting firmware tricks :)

But it's like months between reboots for me. Much better than Windows 
ever was. Most of the time, I reboot because of an OS update.

But... I leave my home Mac on all the time. It's one of the auto-tester 
nodes. Makes me a tad concerned, though I've never had a computer catch 
fire. I've seen etches burn up though when working for a computer 
appliance manufacturer. So it does happen. Never caught fire though, 
just burned up and stopped working.

-Steve
Jul 12 2016
parent Jacob Carlborg <doob me.com> writes:
On 2016-07-12 14:12, Steven Schveighoffer wrote:


 OSX needs a reboot every once in a while. iOS too. In particular, my
 bluetooth system will stop working (and then my trackpad no longer
 works). Yes, I've tried all the resetting firmware tricks :)


I currently have an up time of 79 days.

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg
Jul 12 2016
prev sibling parent reply Chris <wendlec tcd.ie> writes:
On Tuesday, 12 July 2016 at 11:51:48 UTC, Jacob Carlborg wrote:

 On 2016-07-12 11:06, Chris wrote:


 I turn it off every day.


 Sleep can be convenient if you're going to use it later the 
 same day, for example.


 If the OS is up too long (several days), it
 starts to act weirdly and may crash at the most inconvenient 
 time (is
 there a convenient time for a crash?). All OSes are the same 
 in this
 respect, I think Windows is the worst, but Linux and OS X are 
 not much
 better in this respect. Must be some sort of memory pollution.


 I use OS X and I don't recognize that problem.


Maybe if it's up an running, it's not so bad. But if it goes to 
sleep as well, then things get messy. OS X is not the worst 
offender, but the safest thing is to reboot regularly to clean 
the RAM. I don't know what exactly causes crashes and funny 
behavior but I guess it's "polluted" RAM.
Jul 12 2016
next sibling parent Chris <wendlec tcd.ie> writes:
On Tuesday, 12 July 2016 at 13:20:17 UTC, Chris wrote:

 On Tuesday, 12 July 2016 at 11:51:48 UTC, Jacob Carlborg wrote:

 On 2016-07-12 11:06, Chris wrote:


 [...]


 Sleep can be convenient if you're going to use it later the 
 same day, for example.


 [...]


 I use OS X and I don't recognize that problem.


 Maybe if it's up an running, it's not so bad. But if it goes to 
 sleep as well, then things get messy. OS X is not the worst 
 offender, but the safest thing is to reboot regularly to clean 
 the RAM. I don't know what exactly causes crashes and funny 
 behavior but I guess it's "polluted" RAM.


PS Computers with solid state drives boots so fast these days, 
that it's almost as fast to reboot it as to wake it up.
Jul 12 2016
prev sibling parent reply Jacob Carlborg <doob me.com> writes:
On 2016-07-12 15:20, Chris wrote:


 Maybe if it's up an running, it's not so bad. But if it goes to sleep as
 well, then things get messy. OS X is not the worst offender, but the
 safest thing is to reboot regularly to clean the RAM. I don't know what
 exactly causes crashes and funny behavior but I guess it's "polluted" RAM.


I put my computer in sleep mode every night and there's been no 
problems. I have an up time of 79 days.

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg
Jul 12 2016
parent reply Jack Stouffer <jack jackstouffer.com> writes:
On Tuesday, 12 July 2016 at 18:30:58 UTC, Jacob Carlborg wrote:

 On 2016-07-12 15:20, Chris wrote:


 Maybe if it's up an running, it's not so bad. But if it goes 
 to sleep as
 well, then things get messy. OS X is not the worst offender, 
 but the
 safest thing is to reboot regularly to clean the RAM. I don't 
 know what
 exactly causes crashes and funny behavior but I guess it's 
 "polluted" RAM.


 I put my computer in sleep mode every night and there's been no 
 problems. I have an up time of 79 days.


Same here. I'm sitting on a 39 day uptime with no problems.
Jul 12 2016
parent reply "H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d" <digitalmars-d puremagic.com> writes:
On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 07:05:41PM +0000, Jack Stouffer via Digitalmars-d wrote:

 On Tuesday, 12 July 2016 at 18:30:58 UTC, Jacob Carlborg wrote:

 On 2016-07-12 15:20, Chris wrote:
 

 Maybe if it's up an running, it's not so bad. But if it goes to
 sleep as well, then things get messy. OS X is not the worst
 offender, but the safest thing is to reboot regularly to clean the
 RAM. I don't know what exactly causes crashes and funny behavior
 but I guess it's "polluted" RAM.


 
 I put my computer in sleep mode every night and there's been no
 problems. I have an up time of 79 days.


 
 Same here. I'm sitting on a 39 day uptime with no problems.


I leave my PC running all the time, and there's never been a problem. I
never reboot unless there's a power outage or the kernel is being
upgraded or I'm physically moving it somewhere else.  Current uptime is
181 days.  I also have a remote server that's been up 665 days.  Linux
rulez. ;-)


T

-- 
Why waste time reinventing the wheel, when you could be reinventing the engine?
-- Damian Conway
Jul 12 2016
parent reply Jacob Carlborg <doob me.com> writes:
On 2016-07-12 21:09, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote:


 I leave my PC running all the time, and there's never been a problem. I
 never reboot unless there's a power outage or the kernel is being
 upgraded


You don't do "no reboot" kernel patching? ;)

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg
Jul 13 2016
parent reply "H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d" <digitalmars-d puremagic.com> writes:
On Wed, Jul 13, 2016 at 09:49:49AM +0200, Jacob Carlborg via Digitalmars-d
wrote:

 On 2016-07-12 21:09, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote:
 

 I leave my PC running all the time, and there's never been a
 problem. I never reboot unless there's a power outage or the kernel
 is being upgraded


 
 You don't do "no reboot" kernel patching? ;)


[...]

I would, as recent kernels support that now, but just haven't had the
time to figure out how to set it up just yet. :D


T

-- 
Государство делает вид, что платит нам
зарплату, а мы делаем вид, что работаем.
Jul 13 2016
parent Jacob Carlborg <doob me.com> writes:
On 2016-07-13 21:09, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote:


 I would, as recent kernels support that now, but just haven't had the
 time to figure out how to set it up just yet. :D


Seems like Ksplice has been available since 2008 [1]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ksplice

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg
Jul 14 2016
prev sibling parent reply Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/11/2016 11:24 PM, Jacob Carlborg wrote:

 I put my computer into sleep mode when I'm not using it for a longer
 period of time. It seems to shutdown everything but keeps some power to
 keep the data in RAM alive. So it turn back on instantly.


I still have a lingering reluctance to do that, because it wasn't until 
quite recently that the machines would function properly when woken up.

Windows 7 still randomly forgets about its shares when it wakes up.
Jul 12 2016
parent Chris <wendlec tcd.ie> writes:
On Tuesday, 12 July 2016 at 11:28:41 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 On 7/11/2016 11:24 PM, Jacob Carlborg wrote:

 I put my computer into sleep mode when I'm not using it for a 
 longer
 period of time. It seems to shutdown everything but keeps some 
 power to
 keep the data in RAM alive. So it turn back on instantly.


 I still have a lingering reluctance to do that, because it 
 wasn't until quite recently that the machines would function 
 properly when woken up.

 Windows 7 still randomly forgets about its shares when it wakes 
 up.


Yep. Sleep mode always causes trouble (not only on Windows).
Jul 12 2016
prev sibling next sibling parent reply Meta <jared771 gmail.com> writes:
On Sunday, 10 July 2016 at 02:43:42 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu 
wrote:

 Got a text from Walter - his famous fanless graphics card 
 caught fire along with the motherboard. He'll be outta 
 commission for a few days. -- Andrei


It wouldn't happen to be an nVidia card, would it?
Jul 11 2016
parent reply Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/11/2016 7:49 AM, Meta wrote:

 It wouldn't happen to be an nVidia card, would it?


MSI GeForce GT 720 DirectX 12 N720-1GD3HLP 1GB 64-Bit DDR3 PCI Express 
2.0 x16 HDCP Ready Video Card

The fire happened at the junction between the graphics card and the 
motherboard. I'm not totally sure which failed. Could have been a bad 
capacitor on the motherboard. Maybe it was a defect in the connector.

It had been in near continuous use for over a year.
Jul 11 2016
parent reply Michael <michael toohuman.io> writes:
On Monday, 11 July 2016 at 21:29:49 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 On 7/11/2016 7:49 AM, Meta wrote:

 It wouldn't happen to be an nVidia card, would it?


 MSI GeForce GT 720 DirectX 12 N720-1GD3HLP 1GB 64-Bit DDR3 PCI 
 Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready Video Card

 The fire happened at the junction between the graphics card and 
 the motherboard. I'm not totally sure which failed. Could have 
 been a bad capacitor on the motherboard. Maybe it was a defect 
 in the connector.

 It had been in near continuous use for over a year.


Maybe it's time to invest in some "workstation" / server-grade 
stuff if it's going to be running continuously with little moving 
air.
Jul 12 2016
parent reply Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/12/2016 3:08 AM, Michael wrote:

 Maybe it's time to invest in some "workstation" / server-grade stuff if
 it's going to be running continuously with little moving air.


There's still a case fan, cpu fan, and power supply fan, just not one 
dedicated to the card itself. The fire didn't start on the components 
that were attached to the heat sink.

I've run all sorts of computers for 40 years now, have had all sorts of 
hardware failures, and this is the first one that caught fire.

The server hardware I've seen all had very noisy fans. I couldn't bear that.
Jul 12 2016
parent reply Steven Schveighoffer <schveiguy yahoo.com> writes:
On 7/12/16 7:37 AM, Walter Bright wrote:

 On 7/12/2016 3:08 AM, Michael wrote:

 Maybe it's time to invest in some "workstation" / server-grade stuff if
 it's going to be running continuously with little moving air.


 There's still a case fan, cpu fan, and power supply fan, just not one
 dedicated to the card itself. The fire didn't start on the components
 that were attached to the heat sink.

 I've run all sorts of computers for 40 years now, have had all sorts of
 hardware failures, and this is the first one that caught fire.

 The server hardware I've seen all had very noisy fans. I couldn't bear
 that.


I seriously doubt a fan would stop an electrical fire (in fact, probably 
makes it worse). It's not overheating, it's arcing.

BTW, this reminds me of a old goodie:

http://www.netfunny.com/rhf/jokes/96/Jun/nosmoke.html

A old colleague of mine always said when you see smoke, there's no way 
to fix it, because it's really hard to get the smoke back in there.

-Steve
Jul 12 2016
parent deadalnix <deadalnix gmail.com> writes:
On Tuesday, 12 July 2016 at 12:17:00 UTC, Steven Schveighoffer 
wrote:

 I seriously doubt a fan would stop an electrical fire (in fact, 
 probably makes it worse). It's not overheating, it's arcing.


Actually, it would probably make it worse by providing fresh O2 
to the fire.


 BTW, this reminds me of a old goodie:

 http://www.netfunny.com/rhf/jokes/96/Jun/nosmoke.html

 A old colleague of mine always said when you see smoke, there's 
 no way to fix it, because it's really hard to get the smoke 
 back in there.

 -Steve


We had a similar saying when I was involved int he electronic 
world: Chips must be powered by smoke. We know this because once 
it is gone, the chip doesn't work anymore.
Jul 12 2016
prev sibling next sibling parent Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/9/2016 7:43 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:

 Got a text from Walter - his famous fanless graphics card caught fire
 along with the motherboard. He'll be outta commission for a few days. --


I can do email and such with my laptop, but it is not suitable for 
development.

I spent yesterday cleaning many many years of dust out of my office :-) 
though the burned plastic smell lingers.

A new mobo and graphics card were overnighted, hopefully nothing else 
got fried.
Jul 11 2016
prev sibling next sibling parent Andrei Alexandrescu <SeeWebsiteForEmail erdani.org> writes:
On 07/09/2016 10:43 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:

 Got a text from Walter - his famous fanless graphics card caught fire
 along with the motherboard. He'll be outta commission for a few days. --
 Andrei



I didn't mark the original post with [OT] because it was informing the 
community about Walter's whereabouts. Please mark all off-topic 
follow-ups with [OT]. Thanks! -- Andrei
Jul 12 2016
prev sibling parent reply Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/9/2016 7:43 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:

 Got a text from Walter - his famous fanless graphics card caught fire along
with
 the motherboard. He'll be outta commission for a few days. -- Andrei


Back in business now with a new motherboard and new graphics card, which also 
wound up forcing a from scratch reinstall of everything.

I didn't lose any files, but the episode did expose some shortcomings of my 
backup system, so I'm setting about correcting that. Nothing like searching 
everywhere for a missing install CD you haven't seen in years :-(

The award for most painless reinstall goes to Quicken, with Thunderbird Mail 
being the first runner up. They still had problems, though.

A raspberry for most painful reinstall (3 hrs) goes to TL_PS110P print server, 
in conjunction with Microsoft/HP's terrible support for printer installation 
that hasn't improved since 1982 or so.

I'm excluding the pain of Windows reinstall, as it took 14 hours of sitting 
there blankly "checking for updates". I wonder what it was possibly doing that 
took 14 hours (the disk was fresh, there was nothing to transmit to the NSA).

-----------------------

The absolutely easiest reinstall was dmd - I just copied the directory over
from 
the backup - but I suppose handing out awards to ourselves is a bit
narcissistic.
Jul 14 2016
next sibling parent Chris <wendlec tcd.ie> writes:
On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 05:10:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:


 I'm excluding the pain of Windows reinstall, as it took 14 
 hours of sitting there blankly "checking for updates". I wonder 
 what it was possibly doing that took 14 hours (the disk was 
 fresh, there was nothing to transmit to the NSA).


It's just to punish you for using their product. Just to show 
you. Like a well known cheap Irish airline [1] ;)

[1] http://davefaq.com/Opinions/RyanAir-Sucks/
Jul 15 2016
prev sibling next sibling parent reply Meta <jared771 gmail.com> writes:
On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 05:10:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 I'm excluding the pain of Windows reinstall, as it took 14 
 hours of sitting there blankly "checking for updates". I wonder 
 what it was possibly doing that took 14 hours (the disk was 
 fresh, there was nothing to transmit to the NSA).


It's a known Windows issue: 
http://www.infoworld.com/article/3069693/microsoft-windows/windows-7-update-scans-taking-forever-kb-3153199-may-solve-the-problem.html

I had the exact same problem after reinstalling Windows 7 a few 
months ago.
Jul 15 2016
parent reply Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/15/2016 12:16 PM, Meta wrote:

 On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 05:10:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 I'm excluding the pain of Windows reinstall, as it took 14 hours of sitting
 there blankly "checking for updates". I wonder what it was possibly doing that
 took 14 hours (the disk was fresh, there was nothing to transmit to the NSA).


 It's a known Windows issue:
 http://www.infoworld.com/article/3069693/microsoft-windows/windows-7-update-scans-taking-forever-kb-3153199-may-solve-the-problem.html


The article is full of "seems to work", "may work", and "some say it didn't
work".

You'd think Microsoft could attach a debugger to it, figure out exactly why,
and 
fix it. It's staggering how this goes unnoticed and unfixed.



 I had the exact same problem after reinstalling Windows 7 a few months ago.


I've had the problem every time I reinstall Windows 7, on different machines. I 
learned that you had to disable it going to sleep when doing this, else it will 
never ever complete.
Jul 15 2016
parent reply "H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d" <digitalmars-d puremagic.com> writes:
On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 03:44:20PM -0700, Walter Bright via Digitalmars-d wrote:

 On 7/15/2016 12:16 PM, Meta wrote:

 On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 05:10:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 I'm excluding the pain of Windows reinstall, as it took 14 hours
 of sitting there blankly "checking for updates". I wonder what it
 was possibly doing that took 14 hours (the disk was fresh, there
 was nothing to transmit to the NSA).


 
 It's a known Windows issue:
 http://www.infoworld.com/article/3069693/microsoft-windows/windows-7-update-scans-taking-forever-kb-3153199-may-solve-the-problem.html


 
 The article is full of "seems to work", "may work", and "some say it
 didn't work".
 
 You'd think Microsoft could attach a debugger to it, figure out
 exactly why, and fix it. It's staggering how this goes unnoticed and
 unfixed.


One of the many reasons I gave up on Windows many years ago, and never
looked back. ;-)


T

-- 
I don't trust computers, I've spent too long programming to think that
they can get anything right. -- James Miller
Jul 15 2016
parent reply Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/15/2016 3:43 PM, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote:

 One of the many reasons I gave up on Windows many years ago, and never
 looked back. ;-)


I have my grump list for Linux, too. Tried to install it once on an HP laptop, 
and the installer crashed with some long error message in hex. Like a good boy, 
I posted a bug report on it on the distro seb site. One of their devs closed it 
the next day because I wouldn't attach a remote debugger to it.

The Ubuntu printer install isn't any better than Microsoft's. I wonder what it 
is about printers. I can plug in USB drives, internal drives, all sorts of 
things, and they just work.

Even when it's working, the simplest things fail. I learned to never queue a 
second job until the first one is completely finished, else it botches up both
jobs.

It's not like it's a weird printer, either. It's an HP LaserJet, fer chrissakes.
Jul 15 2016
next sibling parent reply "H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d" <digitalmars-d puremagic.com> writes:
On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 05:02:55PM -0700, Walter Bright via Digitalmars-d wrote:

 On 7/15/2016 3:43 PM, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote:

 One of the many reasons I gave up on Windows many years ago, and
 never looked back. ;-)


 
 I have my grump list for Linux, too. Tried to install it once on an HP
 laptop, and the installer crashed with some long error message in hex.
 Like a good boy, I posted a bug report on it on the distro seb site.
 One of their devs closed it the next day because I wouldn't attach a
 remote debugger to it.


I have my list of gripes against Linux, too.  The good thing about
Linux, though, is that if something doesn't work, you can go under the
hood and fix stuff.  Dig into config files and stuff -- which are plain
text as opposed to opaque, unreadable binary format -- and if you're up
for it, download the source and fix it yourself.  And there's lots of
online resources about how to get under the hood and fix things. You can
even replace system executables with your own, if it doesn't do what you
want. In Windows, basically the hood is welded shut, and if there's a
bug in system software, you're basically screwed.

Plus, Linux software generally are much more resilient to customization,
so I can customize the heck out of my system and make it resemble
nothing anyone else would know how to use. Replace system components
with alternatives. Dispense with GUI bloatware altogether and install
ratpoison. Kill off the rodent.  Use Adam's graphical terminal.
Streamline everything to suit the way I work.

In Windows, even something so trivially simple as changing to lazy focus
causes tons of programs to break left, right and center, because
everything is built around a set of implicit assumptions of how the user
is supposed to use the PC.  Trying to do anything other than the
"Windows way" is an exercise in frustration. Not to mention those
endless menus hidden inside submenus that give me an aneurysm just
trying to find that one obscure checkbox that may or may not exist and
may or may not do what I want.  Whereas on Linux I just edit a system
config file, restart a daemon or two, and off I go. No need for my hands
to ever leave the keyboard.



 The Ubuntu printer install isn't any better than Microsoft's. I wonder
 what it is about printers. I can plug in USB drives, internal drives,
 all sorts of things, and they just work.
 
 Even when it's working, the simplest things fail. I learned to never
 queue a second job until the first one is completely finished, else it
 botches up both jobs.
 
 It's not like it's a weird printer, either. It's an HP LaserJet, fer
 chrissakes.


Haha, yes, this is one of the annoying things about Linux. You have to
be careful about what hardware you buy, 'cos some hardware doesn't have
drivers, or only has proprietary drivers (which are inevitably horribly
out of date or somehow incompatible with your system unless you have
100% the exact hardware environment and software settings they used to
test it 15 years ago), or worse, just no driver at all. If you're lucky,
there's a generic driver for it, but be prepared for malfunctions,
missing features, or just outright breakage.  When you get the right
hardware, things Just Work. But when you don't, it's an endless journey
of pain.

You'd think distros like Ubuntu ought to have gotten their act together
in this respect, but sometimes it's still a shot in the dark... Plus, I
hate the default Ubuntu install because it comes with all sorts of cruft
I'm not interested in. I rather just install a plain vanilla no-frills
Debian base system, then add individual components that I actually need,
as I need them.  A couple of years ago I got a new PC with Ubuntu
preinstalled, and the first thing I did upon bootup was to uninstall the
default GUI and a whole bunch of useless stuff, change
/etc/apt/sources.list to point to the Debian repo instead, and install
the exact packages that I need. Now it has been transmogrified into a
custom Debian system, and I like it that way. :-P


T

-- 
People tell me that I'm paranoid, but they're just out to get me.
Jul 15 2016
parent Patrick Schluter <Patrick.Schluter bbox.fr> writes:
On Saturday, 16 July 2016 at 04:54:02 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote:

 On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 05:02:55PM -0700, Walter Bright via 
 Digitalmars-d wrote:

 On 7/15/2016 3:43 PM, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote:

 One of the many reasons I gave up on Windows many years ago, 
 and never looked back. ;-)


 
 I have my grump list for Linux, too. Tried to install it once 
 on an HP laptop, and the installer crashed with some long 
 error message in hex. Like a good boy, I posted a bug report 
 on it on the distro seb site. One of their devs closed it the 
 next day because I wouldn't attach a remote debugger to it.


 I have my list of gripes against Linux, too.  The good thing 
 about Linux, though, is that if something doesn't work, you can 
 go under the hood and fix stuff.  Dig into config files and 
 stuff -- which are plain text as opposed to opaque, unreadable 
 binary format -- and if you're up for it, download the source 
 and fix it yourself.  And there's lots of online resources 
 about how to get under the hood and fix things. You can even 
 replace system executables with your own, if it doesn't do what 
 you want. In Windows, basically the hood is welded shut, and if 
 there's a bug in system software, you're basically screwed.

 Plus, Linux software generally are much more resilient to 
 customization, so I can customize the heck out of my system and 
 make it resemble nothing anyone else would know how to use. 
 Replace system components with alternatives. Dispense with GUI 
 bloatware altogether and install ratpoison. Kill off the 
 rodent.  Use Adam's graphical terminal. Streamline everything 
 to suit the way I work.

 In Windows, even something so trivially simple as changing to 
 lazy focus causes tons of programs to break left, right and 
 center, because everything is built around a set of implicit 
 assumptions of how the user is supposed to use the PC.  Trying 
 to do anything other than the "Windows way" is an exercise in 
 frustration. Not to mention those endless menus hidden inside 
 submenus that give me an aneurysm just trying to find that one 
 obscure checkbox that may or may not exist and may or may not 
 do what I want.  Whereas on Linux I just edit a system config 
 file, restart a daemon or two, and off I go. No need for my 
 hands to ever leave the keyboard.



 The Ubuntu printer install isn't any better than Microsoft's. 
 I wonder what it is about printers. I can plug in USB drives, 
 internal drives, all sorts of things, and they just work.
 
 Even when it's working, the simplest things fail. I learned to 
 never queue a second job until the first one is completely 
 finished, else it botches up both jobs.
 
 It's not like it's a weird printer, either. It's an HP 
 LaserJet, fer chrissakes.


 Haha, yes, this is one of the annoying things about Linux. You 
 have to be careful about what hardware you buy, 'cos some 
 hardware doesn't have drivers, or only has proprietary drivers 
 (which are inevitably horribly out of date or somehow 
 incompatible with your system unless you have 100% the exact 
 hardware environment and software settings they used to test it 
 15 years ago), or worse, just no driver at all. If you're 
 lucky, there's a generic driver for it, but be prepared for 
 malfunctions, missing features, or just outright breakage.  
 When you get the right hardware, things Just Work. But when you 
 don't, it's an endless journey of pain.

 You'd think distros like Ubuntu ought to have gotten their act 
 together in this respect, but sometimes it's still a shot in 
 the dark... Plus, I hate the default Ubuntu install because it 
 comes with all sorts of cruft I'm not interested in. I rather 
 just install a plain vanilla no-frills Debian base system, then 
 add individual components that I actually need, as I need them.
  A couple of years ago I got a new PC with Ubuntu preinstalled, 
 and the first thing I did upon bootup was to uninstall the 
 default GUI and a whole bunch of useless stuff, change 
 /etc/apt/sources.list to point to the Debian repo instead, and 
 install the exact packages that I need. Now it has been 
 transmogrified into a custom Debian system, and I like it that 
 way. :-P


I had much better result with SuSE than with Mint (i.e. an Ubuntu 
based distro) concerning hardware support. On Linux impossible to 
get my Samsung Laser Printer and my Canon scanner to work. The 
laser printer would only ever print one page with the message 
that it can't print, bummer. On SuSE in worked out of the box. 
The annoying thing with SuSE was that it installed sys partition 
with btrfs, on small partition it is problematic because the 
snapshoting could fill it up until breakage, annoying.
Jul 16 2016
prev sibling parent Alix Pexton <alixDOTpexton gmail.com> writes:
On 16/07/2016 01:02, Walter Bright wrote:

 The Ubuntu printer install isn't any better than Microsoft's. I wonder
 what it is about printers. I can plug in USB drives, internal drives,
 all sorts of things, and they just work.

 Even when it's working, the simplest things fail. I learned to never
 queue a second job until the first one is completely finished, else it
 botches up both jobs.

 It's not like it's a weird printer, either. It's an HP LaserJet, fer
 chrissakes.


With my HP printer, if I don't turn it off between print, the computer 
freezes up after about 30 mins, happened with windows & and motivated my 
move to 10, but it still happens there too.
Jul 16 2016
prev sibling next sibling parent reply Jack Stouffer <jack jackstouffer.com> writes:
On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 05:10:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 The absolutely easiest reinstall was dmd - I just copied the 
 directory over from the backup - but I suppose handing out 
 awards to ourselves is a bit narcissistic.


Always nice to dog food every once and a while to confirm it 
though.

OT: Why is the install process for mac apps so much nicer 
compared to windows apps?

To install something on OS X, drag the application from the .dmg 
folder to your application folder, and you're done. Windows apps 
always have me go through a multistep "install wizard" that takes 
anywhere from 2 minutes to a half hour depending on the app :/
Jul 15 2016
parent reply Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/15/2016 12:46 PM, Jack Stouffer wrote:

 On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 05:10:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 The absolutely easiest reinstall was dmd - I just copied the directory over
 from the backup - but I suppose handing out awards to ourselves is a bit
 narcissistic.


 Always nice to dog food every once and a while to confirm it though.

 OT: Why is the install process for mac apps so much nicer compared to windows
apps?

 To install something on OS X, drag the application from the .dmg folder to your
 application folder, and you're done. Windows apps always have me go through a
 multistep "install wizard" that takes anywhere from 2 minutes to a half hour
 depending on the app :/


For a time at Symantec I pushed through making the compiler runnable directly 
off of the CD without requiring an installation. Just put the CD in, and you 
could do everything (a little slowly, of course, since CDs are slow).

I was bemused by so many people who simply could not accept that this could
even 
work, they were so conditioned by installation programs. If I wasn't paying 
attention, Symantec would revert to type and require an installation program
for 
it. :-)
Jul 15 2016
parent reply Adam D. Ruppe <destructionator gmail.com> writes:
On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 22:48:14 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 For a time at Symantec I pushed through making the compiler 
 runnable directly off of the CD without requiring an 
 installation.


Fun fact: this was basically THE killer feature of the Digital 
Mars compiler for me way back when. I started on a school 
computer where I couldn't install anything, and later, when I got 
a home computer, I kept it on disc.

To this day, I still use dmd the same way: unzip it and call the 
program in-place instead of trying to install it.
Jul 15 2016
next sibling parent reply Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/15/2016 3:55 PM, Adam D. Ruppe wrote:

 On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 22:48:14 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 For a time at Symantec I pushed through making the compiler runnable directly
 off of the CD without requiring an installation.


 Fun fact: this was basically THE killer feature of the Digital Mars compiler
for
 me way back when. I started on a school computer where I couldn't install
 anything, and later, when I got a home computer, I kept it on disc.

 To this day, I still use dmd the same way: unzip it and call the program
 in-place instead of trying to install it.


Nice to hear that!

BTW, even if an app requires all sorts of registry settings, that is still no 
excuse. Have a config file, and when the app starts up, it looks for the 
registry settings. If not there, it reads the config file, and sets the
registry 
settings. I.e. it self-installs.

Every app should have a "Backup/restore all my data/settings to/from a single 
file" menu item. That's what's wrong with Thunderbird, who does something even 
stupider by putting the data in hidden directories.
Jul 15 2016
parent Jacob Carlborg <doob me.com> writes:
On 2016-07-16 02:06, Walter Bright wrote:


 BTW, even if an app requires all sorts of registry settings, that is
 still no excuse. Have a config file, and when the app starts up, it
 looks for the registry settings. If not there, it reads the config file,
 and sets the registry settings. I.e. it self-installs.


I think that's what most applications on OS X do. They usually store 
configs in ~/Library/Preferences but they don't need an installer for 
that. On the other hand, the configs are just plain text in the plist 
format.

-- 
/Jacob Carlborg
Jul 16 2016
prev sibling parent "H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d" <digitalmars-d puremagic.com> writes:
On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 10:55:06PM +0000, Adam D. Ruppe via Digitalmars-d wrote:

 On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 22:48:14 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 For a time at Symantec I pushed through making the compiler runnable
 directly off of the CD without requiring an installation.


 
 Fun fact: this was basically THE killer feature of the Digital Mars
 compiler for me way back when. I started on a school computer where I
 couldn't install anything, and later, when I got a home computer, I
 kept it on disc.
 
 To this day, I still use dmd the same way: unzip it and call the
 program in-place instead of trying to install it.


Nowadays I almost never install software unless it comes prepackaged
with my OS's packaging system and can be installed/uninstalled with a
single command.  For things like dmd I just set my PATH to run it
directly from dmd/src where it was built.  For things that need to
install a whole bunch of stuff in an entire filesystem hierarchy, I
usually recompile it with PREFIX set to a subdirectory dedicated to
everything related to that program, and install it there (with
appropriate PATH settings).

The main reason is that almost all software these days install needless
junk all over the place, and there's no way to ensure that an uninstall
didn't leave detritus behind if I just let it install into the system
directories.  When it's inside a dedicated directory I just blast the
whole thing away when I want to uninstall.


T

-- 
They pretend to pay us, and we pretend to work. -- Russian saying
Jul 15 2016
prev sibling parent reply Joakim <dlang joakim.fea.st> writes:
On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 05:10:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 I'm excluding the pain of Windows reinstall, as it took 14 
 hours of sitting there blankly "checking for updates". I wonder 
 what it was possibly doing that took 14 hours (the disk was 
 fresh, there was nothing to transmit to the NSA).


If you're talking about Windows 7, speculation is that MS is 
doing that on purpose: they don't package a Service Pack 2 
because they want to make it painful for you, so painful that you 
install or upgrade to Windows 10 instead, the latter still free 
for the next two weeks.  They did produce something like a Win7 
SP2, but you have to manually download it, Windows Update won't 
just go get it:

http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2016/05/windows-7-now-has-a-service-pack-2-but-dont-call-it-that/

As for printing, you're still printing?  I think I've printed 
maybe three or four times in the last decade, but then I almost 
never read anything on paper during that time either.
Jul 15 2016
next sibling parent reply "H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d" <digitalmars-d puremagic.com> writes:
On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 04:30:31AM +0000, Joakim via Digitalmars-d wrote:

 On Friday, 15 July 2016 at 05:10:29 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 I'm excluding the pain of Windows reinstall, as it took 14 hours of
 sitting there blankly "checking for updates". I wonder what it was
 possibly doing that took 14 hours (the disk was fresh, there was
 nothing to transmit to the NSA).


 
 If you're talking about Windows 7, speculation is that MS is doing
 that on purpose: they don't package a Service Pack 2 because they want
 to make it painful for you, so painful that you install or upgrade to
 Windows 10 instead, the latter still free for the next two weeks.


[...]

Argh... this is one of the most annoying things MS has done recently.  I
come home one day, and my wife is all frustrated that she can't finish
doing what she was doing because the PC was upgrading itself to Windows
10 and it was taking a LONG time. I had told her not to, and I thought
she had foolishly clicked Yes, but in fact she didn't. Apparently MS has
made it such that you don't even have a choice now. Whether you like it
or not the update just forces itself on you. I'm sure there's a way to
cancel it, but it involves going into obscure corners of the registry or
some well-hidden submenu of submenus, which my wife wouldn't have a clue
how to do.

Now I'm stuck with this horrendous new GUI that I hate even more than
Windows 7, every time I have to do something on my wife's laptop. Not to
mention the system requirements are ever skyrocketing, and now the PC is
15% slower doing EXACTLY THE SAME THINGS I USED TO DO BEFORE, on EXACTLY
THE SAME HARDWARE, as far as I can tell just for some flashy eye candy
that, in my eyes, look even worse and more dysfunctional than before.
Grrrr...  If it weren't for the convenient fact that my wife needs to
use certain websites that can only work under Windows (wow, I thought
this was web-standards-compliant 2016, not 1995 vendor lock-in hell, but
apparently I was wrong), I'd have installed Linux on the machine
instead.  Even though Linux sucks too, at least it doesn't force-install
newer, more broken versions of itself without you asking for it.


T

-- 
Tech-savvy: euphemism for nerdy.
Jul 15 2016
parent reply Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/15/2016 10:09 PM, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote:

 Even though Linux sucks too, at least it doesn't force-install
 newer, more broken versions of itself without you asking for it.


You have to go into the windows update menu and select the only install
critical 
updates.

I upgraded my laptop to Windows 10, and after using it for a bit decided to
keep 
my main dev machine on 7.
Jul 15 2016
parent "H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d" <digitalmars-d puremagic.com> writes:
On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 10:33:05PM -0700, Walter Bright via Digitalmars-d wrote:

 On 7/15/2016 10:09 PM, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote:

 Even though Linux sucks too, at least it doesn't force-install
 newer, more broken versions of itself without you asking for it.


 
 You have to go into the windows update menu and select the only install
 critical updates.


So I found out after the fact. :-(  It wasn't something my wife would've
been capable of doing. And I don't use Windows nearly often enough to
justify spending the time to learn about obscure things like this. (In
fact, about the only things I ever run on Windows are putty and firefox.
:P  All my "serious" work is done on my Linux PC, usually remotely via
ssh.)



 I upgraded my laptop to Windows 10, and after using it for a bit
 decided to keep my main dev machine on 7.


Wise man. ;-)


T

-- 
People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which
they avoid. -- Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)
Jul 15 2016
prev sibling parent reply Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com> writes:
On 7/15/2016 9:30 PM, Joakim wrote:

 As for printing, you're still printing?  I think I've printed maybe three or
 four times in the last decade, but then I almost never read anything on paper
 during that time either.


Sometimes I have to sign a document, scan it, and email it back. An inevitable 
chore when running a business. At least people don't try to fax me things
anymore.
Jul 15 2016
parent John Colvin <john.loughran.colvin gmail.com> writes:
On Saturday, 16 July 2016 at 05:26:56 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:

 On 7/15/2016 9:30 PM, Joakim wrote:

 As for printing, you're still printing?  I think I've printed 
 maybe three or
 four times in the last decade, but then I almost never read 
 anything on paper
 during that time either.


 Sometimes I have to sign a document, scan it, and email it 
 back. An inevitable chore when running a business. At least 
 people don't try to fax me things anymore.


I find a lot of places are quite happy with me just editing the 
document and pasting a copy of my signature on top, no need for 
printing&scanning at any point.
Jul 16 2016