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digitalmars.D.announce - dmd 1.054 and 2.038 release
Hello Walter,
Happy New Year!
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/1.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.1.054.zip
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/2.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.2.038.zip
Many thanks to the numerous people who contributed to this update.
New updates, Always nice to see! Damn, I like to see those long list of bugs!
Hello Walter,
Happy New Year!
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/1.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.1.054.zip
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/2.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.2.038.zip
Many thanks to the numerous people who contributed to this update.
Oh cool, I think I'm going to like this one: 2816: "Sudden-death static assert
is not very useful"
12 Grammar fixes? Sweeeeet!
Walter Bright:
Happy New Year!
Happy end of the year to you too!
Is this the last release for the 2009? ;-)
This is funny:
min(x, y) = 10; // sets x to 10
This looks by far like the most useful improvement/change of this DMD release,
I've already tried it and I like it a lot, thanks to Don and to you!
Bugzilla 2816: Sudden-death static assert is not very useful<
Bye,
bearophile
bearophile wrote:
This is funny: min(x, y) = 10; // sets x to 10
This looks by far like the most useful improvement/change of this DMD
release, I've already tried it and I like it a lot, thanks to Don and
to you!
A lot of credit also goes to Andrei for design issues, and some others
who also submitted bugzilla reports and patches, such as Rainer Schuetze.
I don't think the min() example is that useful, I can't think of when I
ever needed it. But min() is important as one of those metaprogramming
"litmus tests" that are the canary that indicates whether one has a
complete system or not.
Walter Bright:
I don't think the min() example is that useful,
No, I meant it's the Bugzilla 2816 that's very useful! :-)
Bye,
bearophile
bearophile wrote:
Walter Bright:
Happy New Year!
Happy end of the year to you too!
Is this the last release for the 2009? ;-)
This is funny:
min(x, y) = 10; // sets x to 10
This looks by far like the most useful improvement/change of this DMD release,
I've already tried it and I like it a lot, thanks to Don and to you!
Bugzilla 2816: Sudden-death static assert is not very useful<
I can't take credit for that. It comes from the LDC guys, I just
enhanced it slightly.
There are 26 Bugzilla votes fixed in this release, which is probably a
record. (I'm assuming bug 1961('scoped const') is considered to be fixed).
Steven Schveighoffer wrote:
(I'm assuming bug 1961('scoped const') is considered to be
fixed).
Sadly, it's not fixed yet :(
struct S
{
int x;
inout(int)* getX() inout { return &x;}
}
void main()
{
S s;
int *x = s.getX();
}
testinout.d(10): Error: function testinout.S.getX () inout is not
callable using argument types ()
testinout.d(10): Error: cannot implicitly convert expression (s.getX())
of type inout(int)* to int*
It appears the auto-conversion is not happening on the return, and also
the call isn't working.
The inout on the return has to be at the top level, as in inout(int *).
This probably needs improvement.
Steven Schveighoffer wrote:
The only thing I could get to work is this:
struct S
{
int x;
}
inout(int *) getSX(inout S* s) { return &s.x;}
void main()
{
S s;
const(S)* sp = &s;
int *x = getSX(&s);
//int *y = getSX(sp); // uncomment this line for an error
const(int) *y = getSX(sp);
}
If you uncomment the designated line, the error reads:
testinout.d(13): Error: cannot implicitly convert expression (getSX(sp))
of type const(int*) to int*
which looks good.
The error looks misleading to me. The error is with the input argument to
the function, not the return type.
Steven Schveighoffer wrote:
On Thu, 31 Dec 2009 16:20:08 -0500, Walter Bright
<newshound1 digitalmars.com> wrote:
Steven Schveighoffer wrote:
(I'm assuming bug 1961('scoped const') is considered to be fixed).
struct S
{
int x;
inout(int)* getX() inout { return &x;}
}
void main()
{
S s;
int *x = s.getX();
}
testinout.d(10): Error: function testinout.S.getX () inout is not
callable using argument types ()
testinout.d(10): Error: cannot implicitly convert expression
(s.getX()) of type inout(int)* to int*
It appears the auto-conversion is not happening on the return, and
also the call isn't working.
The inout on the return has to be at the top level, as in inout(int
*). This probably needs improvement.
Yes, this is an important distinction.
With your recommended change, the error is now:
testinout.d(4): Error: inout on return means inout must be on a
parameter as well for inout inout(int*)()
inout doesn't seem to work with ref either. The only thing I could get
to work is this:
struct S
{
int x;
}
inout(int *) getSX(inout S* s) { return &s.x;}
void main()
{
S s;
const(S)* sp = &s;
int *x = getSX(&s);
//int *y = getSX(sp); // uncomment this line for an error
const(int) *y = getSX(sp);
}
If you uncomment the designated line, the error reads:
testinout.d(13): Error: cannot implicitly convert expression (getSX(sp))
of type const(int*) to int*
which looks good.
-Steve
Well I'm sorry to tell that inout is useless as currently implemented.
One important motivating use case was:
inout(char)[] blah(inout(char)[] input) {
return input;
}
void main()
{
blah("xyz");
blah("xyz".dup);
}
That doesn't work at all. The second motivating case also doesn't work:
class A {
A _next;
inout A next() inout { return _next; }
}
void main()
{
auto a = new A;
const b = a;
auto c = a.next();
auto d = b.next();
}
There are few, if any, cases where the current inout does help. The good
news is that most of the implementation effort has been done so probably
making things work will not be very difficult.
Andrei
Steven Schveighoffer Wrote:
struct S
{
int x;
inout(int)* getX() inout { return &x;}
}
void main()
{
S s;
int *x = s.getX();
}
testinout.d(10): Error: function testinout.S.getX () inout is not callable
using argument types ()
That's the same error message as
http://d.puremagic.com/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=3642
Does that error message ever pop up in a meaningful context???
testinout.d(10): Error: cannot implicitly convert expression (s.getX()) of
type inout(int)* to int*
At least in this case, there are other error messages that give a strong hint
to what the real cause is. I'm still crossing my fingers that 3642 can be
improved in some way.
On Thu, 31 Dec 2009 15:05:56 -0500, Don <nospam nospam.com> wrote:
bearophile wrote:
Walter Bright:
Happy New Year!
Is this the last release for the 2009? ;-)
This is funny:
min(x, y) = 10; // sets x to 10
This looks by far like the most useful improvement/change of this DMD
release, I've already tried it and I like it a lot, thanks to Don and
to you!
Bugzilla 2816: Sudden-death static assert is not very useful<
I can't take credit for that. It comes from the LDC guys, I just
enhanced it slightly.
There are 26 Bugzilla votes fixed in this release, which is probably a
record. (I'm assuming bug 1961('scoped const') is considered to be
fixed).
Sadly, it's not fixed yet :(
struct S
{
int x;
inout(int)* getX() inout { return &x;}
}
void main()
{
S s;
int *x = s.getX();
}
testinout.d(10): Error: function testinout.S.getX () inout is not callable
using argument types ()
testinout.d(10): Error: cannot implicitly convert expression (s.getX()) of
type inout(int)* to int*
It appears the auto-conversion is not happening on the return, and also
the call isn't working.
I'm surprised this was listed as an implemented feature... Is there some
test code that you were using to confirm this Walter?
-Steve
On Thu, 31 Dec 2009 16:20:08 -0500, Walter Bright
<newshound1 digitalmars.com> wrote:
Steven Schveighoffer wrote:
(I'm assuming bug 1961('scoped const') is considered to be fixed).
struct S
{
int x;
inout(int)* getX() inout { return &x;}
}
void main()
{
S s;
int *x = s.getX();
}
testinout.d(10): Error: function testinout.S.getX () inout is not
callable using argument types ()
testinout.d(10): Error: cannot implicitly convert expression (s.getX())
of type inout(int)* to int*
It appears the auto-conversion is not happening on the return, and
also the call isn't working.
The inout on the return has to be at the top level, as in inout(int *).
This probably needs improvement.
Yes, this is an important distinction.
With your recommended change, the error is now:
testinout.d(4): Error: inout on return means inout must be on a parameter
as well for inout inout(int*)()
inout doesn't seem to work with ref either. The only thing I could get to
work is this:
struct S
{
int x;
}
inout(int *) getSX(inout S* s) { return &s.x;}
void main()
{
S s;
const(S)* sp = &s;
int *x = getSX(&s);
//int *y = getSX(sp); // uncomment this line for an error
const(int) *y = getSX(sp);
}
If you uncomment the designated line, the error reads:
testinout.d(13): Error: cannot implicitly convert expression (getSX(sp))
of type const(int*) to int*
which looks good.
-Steve
On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 11:16:00 -0500, Andrei Alexandrescu
<SeeWebsiteForEmail erdani.org> wrote:
Well I'm sorry to tell that inout is useless as currently implemented.
One important motivating use case was:
inout(char)[] blah(inout(char)[] input) {
return input;
}
void main()
{
blah("xyz");
blah("xyz".dup);
}
That doesn't work at all.
Yeah, I think walter said the inout currently must apply to the entire
parameter/return value. That is a severe limitation I think, but the fact
that it parses makes me think it's a simple fix. It's almost like the
type system is working right, but the trigger to convert inout back and
forth isn't firing.
The second motivating case also doesn't work:
class A {
A _next;
inout A next() inout { return _next; }
}
void main()
{
auto a = new A;
const b = a;
auto c = a.next();
auto d = b.next();
}
I found that inout member functions don't work at all. It's almost as if
the compiler ignores the inout designation when doing the inout const
match.
There are few, if any, cases where the current inout does help. The good
news is that most of the implementation effort has been done so probably
making things work will not be very difficult.
Yeah, I just was disappointed that it was listed as implemented. Half
implemented is ok, as long as it will be fixed.
-Steve
Walter Bright wrote:
Happy New Year!
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/1.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.1.054.zip
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/2.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.2.038.zip
Many thanks to the numerous people who contributed to this update.
Tons of bug fixes == great!
But I have a problem: the compiler is either extremely slow for me, or
is stuck in an endless loop. All it does is to slowly allocate memory. I
aborted the compilation after ~ 20 minutes and 2 GB RAM allocation. This
wasn't the case with dmd 1.053, where it only took 5-10 seconds to compile.
Can anyone confirm this?
grauzone:
But I have a problem: the compiler is either extremely slow for me, or
is stuck in an endless loop. All it does is to slowly allocate memory. I
aborted the compilation after ~ 20 minutes and 2 GB RAM allocation. This
wasn't the case with dmd 1.053, where it only took 5-10 seconds to compile.
Can anyone confirm this?
Show the code!
Bye,
bearophile
bearophile wrote:
grauzone:
But I have a problem: the compiler is either extremely slow for me, or
is stuck in an endless loop. All it does is to slowly allocate memory. I
aborted the compilation after ~ 20 minutes and 2 GB RAM allocation. This
wasn't the case with dmd 1.053, where it only took 5-10 seconds to compile.
Can anyone confirm this?
Show the code!
I was going to say "but it's hundreds of modules", but then I tried to
compile some other big hog of code: Tango.
And I found compiling this file hangs:
http://dsource.org/projects/tango/browser/trunk/tango/core/tools/Demangler.d?rev=5248
The exact command line for this was:
dmd -c -I../tango/core -I.. -I../tango/core/vendor -release
-oftango-core-tools-Demangler-release.o ../tango/core/tools/Demangler.d
Again, could anyone confirm this?
Anyway, no time for this anymore, it's going to be 2010 soon here.
Bye,
bearophile
Moritz Warning wrote:
On Thu, 31 Dec 2009 21:22:58 +0100, grauzone wrote:
bearophile wrote:
grauzone:
But I have a problem: the compiler is either extremely slow for me, or
is stuck in an endless loop. All it does is to slowly allocate memory.
I aborted the compilation after ~ 20 minutes and 2 GB RAM allocation.
This wasn't the case with dmd 1.053, where it only took 5-10 seconds
to compile. Can anyone confirm this?
compile some other big hog of code: Tango.
And I found compiling this file hangs:
http://dsource.org/projects/tango/browser/trunk/tango/core/tools/
The exact command line for this was:
dmd -c -I../tango/core -I.. -I../tango/core/vendor -release
-oftango-core-tools-Demangler-release.o ../tango/core/tools/Demangler.d
Again, could anyone confirm this?
Anyway, no time for this anymore, it's going to be 2010 soon here.
Bye,
bearophile
http://d.puremagic.com/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=3663
It's caused by the patch for bug 400.
Moritz Warning wrote:
On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 22:35:12 +0000, Moritz Warning wrote:
On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 19:31:49 +0100, Don wrote:
Moritz Warning wrote:
On Thu, 31 Dec 2009 21:22:58 +0100, grauzone wrote:
bearophile wrote:
grauzone:
But I have a problem: the compiler is either extremely slow for me,
or is stuck in an endless loop. All it does is to slowly allocate
memory. I aborted the compilation after ~ 20 minutes and 2 GB RAM
allocation. This wasn't the case with dmd 1.053, where it only took
5-10 seconds to compile. Can anyone confirm this?
to compile some other big hog of code: Tango.
And I found compiling this file hangs:
http://dsource.org/projects/tango/browser/trunk/tango/core/tools/
The exact command line for this was:
dmd -c -I../tango/core -I.. -I../tango/core/vendor -release
-oftango-core-tools-Demangler-release.o
../tango/core/tools/Demangler.d
Again, could anyone confirm this?
Anyway, no time for this anymore, it's going to be 2010 soon here.
Bye,
bearophile
http://d.puremagic.com/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=3663
But now there is another problem/regression:
tango/net/device/Berkeley.d(1065): Error: enum member
tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.ADDR_ANY conflicts with enum
member tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.ADDR_ANY at
tango/net/device/ Berkeley.d(1065)
tango/net/device/Berkeley.d(1066): Error: enum member
tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.ADDR_NONE conflicts with enum
member tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.ADDR_NONE at tango/net/
device/Berkeley.d(1066)
tango/net/device/Berkeley.d(1067): Error: enum member
tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.PORT_ANY conflicts with enum
member tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.PORT_ANY at
tango/net/device/ Berkeley.d(1067)
I've made a ticket:
http://d.puremagic.com/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=3664
(tested with original dmd 1.054)
Don wrote:
That's also caused by the other half of the patch for 400, in class.c.
There's a patch up now for it.
On Thu, 31 Dec 2009 21:03:25 +0100, grauzone wrote:
Walter Bright wrote:
Happy New Year!
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/1.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.1.054.zip
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/2.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.2.038.zip
Many thanks to the numerous people who contributed to this update.
Tons of bug fixes == great!
But I have a problem: the compiler is either extremely slow for me, or
is stuck in an endless loop. All it does is to slowly allocate memory. I
aborted the compilation after ~ 20 minutes and 2 GB RAM allocation. This
wasn't the case with dmd 1.053, where it only took 5-10 seconds to
compile.
Can anyone confirm this?
I just stumbled over the problem compiling Tango trunk with dmd 1.054.
It works on Windows.
On Thu, 31 Dec 2009 21:22:58 +0100, grauzone wrote:
bearophile wrote:
grauzone:
But I have a problem: the compiler is either extremely slow for me, or
is stuck in an endless loop. All it does is to slowly allocate memory.
I aborted the compilation after ~ 20 minutes and 2 GB RAM allocation.
This wasn't the case with dmd 1.053, where it only took 5-10 seconds
to compile. Can anyone confirm this?
Show the code!
I was going to say "but it's hundreds of modules", but then I tried to
compile some other big hog of code: Tango.
And I found compiling this file hangs:
http://dsource.org/projects/tango/browser/trunk/tango/core/tools/
The exact command line for this was:
dmd -c -I../tango/core -I.. -I../tango/core/vendor -release
-oftango-core-tools-Demangler-release.o ../tango/core/tools/Demangler.d
Again, could anyone confirm this?
Anyway, no time for this anymore, it's going to be 2010 soon here.
Bye,
bearophile
http://d.puremagic.com/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=3663
On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 19:31:49 +0100, Don wrote:
Moritz Warning wrote:
On Thu, 31 Dec 2009 21:22:58 +0100, grauzone wrote:
bearophile wrote:
grauzone:
But I have a problem: the compiler is either extremely slow for me,
or is stuck in an endless loop. All it does is to slowly allocate
memory. I aborted the compilation after ~ 20 minutes and 2 GB RAM
allocation. This wasn't the case with dmd 1.053, where it only took
5-10 seconds to compile. Can anyone confirm this?
compile some other big hog of code: Tango.
And I found compiling this file hangs:
http://dsource.org/projects/tango/browser/trunk/tango/core/tools/
The exact command line for this was:
dmd -c -I../tango/core -I.. -I../tango/core/vendor -release
-oftango-core-tools-Demangler-release.o
../tango/core/tools/Demangler.d
Again, could anyone confirm this?
Anyway, no time for this anymore, it's going to be 2010 soon here.
Bye,
bearophile
http://d.puremagic.com/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=3663
It's caused by the patch for bug 400.
Thanks, that fixed it.
But now there is another problem/regression:
tango/net/device/Berkeley.d(1065): Error: enum member
tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.ADDR_ANY conflicts with enum member
tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.ADDR_ANY at tango/net/device/
Berkeley.d(1065)
tango/net/device/Berkeley.d(1066): Error: enum member
tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.ADDR_NONE conflicts with enum
member tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.ADDR_NONE at tango/net/
device/Berkeley.d(1066)
tango/net/device/Berkeley.d(1067): Error: enum member
tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.PORT_ANY conflicts with enum member
tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.PORT_ANY at tango/net/device/
Berkeley.d(1067)
On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 22:35:12 +0000, Moritz Warning wrote:
On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 19:31:49 +0100, Don wrote:
Moritz Warning wrote:
On Thu, 31 Dec 2009 21:22:58 +0100, grauzone wrote:
bearophile wrote:
grauzone:
But I have a problem: the compiler is either extremely slow for me,
or is stuck in an endless loop. All it does is to slowly allocate
memory. I aborted the compilation after ~ 20 minutes and 2 GB RAM
allocation. This wasn't the case with dmd 1.053, where it only took
5-10 seconds to compile. Can anyone confirm this?
to compile some other big hog of code: Tango.
And I found compiling this file hangs:
http://dsource.org/projects/tango/browser/trunk/tango/core/tools/
The exact command line for this was:
dmd -c -I../tango/core -I.. -I../tango/core/vendor -release
-oftango-core-tools-Demangler-release.o
../tango/core/tools/Demangler.d
Again, could anyone confirm this?
Anyway, no time for this anymore, it's going to be 2010 soon here.
Bye,
bearophile
http://d.puremagic.com/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=3663
It's caused by the patch for bug 400.
Thanks, that fixed it.
But now there is another problem/regression:
tango/net/device/Berkeley.d(1065): Error: enum member
tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.ADDR_ANY conflicts with enum
member tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.ADDR_ANY at
tango/net/device/ Berkeley.d(1065)
tango/net/device/Berkeley.d(1066): Error: enum member
tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.ADDR_NONE conflicts with enum
member tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.ADDR_NONE at tango/net/
device/Berkeley.d(1066)
tango/net/device/Berkeley.d(1067): Error: enum member
tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.PORT_ANY conflicts with enum
member tango.net.device.Berkeley.IPv4Address.PORT_ANY at
tango/net/device/ Berkeley.d(1067)
I've made a ticket:
http://d.puremagic.com/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=3664
(tested with original dmd 1.054)
On Sat, 02 Jan 2010 12:24:18 -0800, Walter Bright wrote:
Don wrote:
That's also caused by the other half of the patch for 400, in class.c.
There's a patch up now for it.
Thanks, I've build dmd from trunk and I've got
Tango and QTD (D1) compiled.
"Walter Bright" <newshound1 digitalmars.com> wrote in message
news:hhirlb$fj0$1 digitalmars.com...
Happy New Year!
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/1.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.1.054.zip
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/2.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.2.038.zip
Many thanks to the numerous people who contributed to this update.
Improved static assert messages and a few forward reference fixes ==
Awesome!
On 2009-12-31 13:48:09 -0500, Walter Bright <newshound1 digitalmars.com> said:
Happy New Year!
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/1.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.1.054.zip
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/2.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.2.038.zip
Many thanks to the numerous people who contributed to this update.
Thanks.
There's a quite annoying bug on Mac OS X that I've been able to reduce
to a very simple test case. Depending on link order, static
initializers might not work, resulting in, among other things, a
non-functional writeln.
Also when that happens even 'throw' often does not work (execution
continues after throw!). It seems linked. This makes 'enforce'
non-functional and you get a null dereference when calling writeln
instead of an exception.
The workaround seems to be to always link first the module containing
'main'. But it's quite annoying that you can get a segfault with a
program as simple as hello world split in two modules. Would it be
possible to look at it?
<http://d.puremagic.com/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=3453>
--
Michel Fortin
michel.fortin michelf.com
http://michelf.com/
Am 31.12.2009 19:48, schrieb Walter Bright:
Happy New Year!
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/1.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.1.054.zip
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/2.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.2.038.zip
Many thanks to the numerous people who contributed to this update.
Great to see so many fixes that make the language much more hassle-free
to use - especially for newcomers that hit such things for the first
time. However, I have at least one blocker problem in this release:
Because of the now disallowed struct initializers for structs with
constructors (bug 3476), there is no way to use those structs as static
immutable values as the constructors are not CTFE processable.
(-> Error: cannot evaluate ((X __ctmp2;
) , __ctmp2).this() at compile time)
This problem has been there since struct constructors have been
introduced. A quick search on bugzilla did not return a matching
bug report, only some other issues related to struct constructors. I'll
file a bug report if noone else knows of any existing one (technically
this would be an 'improvement', but I think it is a really important issue).
This exact place in my code (something like struct Vector(S){ static
invariant Vector zero = Vector(0, 0); }) had to be modified after almost
every compiler release and also rendered a lot of versions useless for
me because there was somtimes no real workaround.
BTW: I was not really watching the newsgroups lately and just noticed
the DIP2/inout implementation. IMO 'inout' is really not a good choice
for the keyword, introducing a backwards imcompatibility, changing the
meaning of a de-facto standard keyword (IDL etc) and not really hitting
the point (placeholder for const/immutable/nothing). Also if I did not
know about the concept of DIP2 such code would have been a mystery for me.
Sönke
Sönke Ludwig:
BTW: I was not really watching the newsgroups lately and just noticed
the DIP2/inout implementation. IMO 'inout' is really not a good choice
for the keyword, introducing a backwards imcompatibility, changing the
meaning of a de-facto standard keyword (IDL etc) and not really hitting
the point (placeholder for const/immutable/nothing). Also if I did not
know about the concept of DIP2 such code would have been a mystery for me.
It seems that Walter has yet to learn that names are important. Using nearly
random words (and syntax) to express ideas and features, as currently done in
D2, is bad. It's the silly "invariant" / "immutable" story again.
Python devs ask all people how to name things before, and then Guido V. R.
picks the most popular name. They do this because a single person may have some
bias: what is intuitive for a person (like Guido, or Walter, or Andrei) may be
not intuitive for most other people. Choosing one of the most popular choices
can't solve all problems, but it helps finding a name/syntax that will result
intuitive for most future programmers.
Bye,
bearophile
bearophile wrote:
Sönke Ludwig:
BTW: I was not really watching the newsgroups lately and just
noticed the DIP2/inout implementation. IMO 'inout' is really not a
good choice for the keyword, introducing a backwards
imcompatibility, changing the meaning of a de-facto standard
keyword (IDL etc) and not really hitting the point (placeholder for
const/immutable/nothing). Also if I did not know about the concept
of DIP2 such code would have been a mystery for me.
It seems that Walter has yet to learn that names are important. Using
nearly random words (and syntax) to express ideas and features, as
currently done in D2, is bad. It's the silly "invariant" /
"immutable" story again.
Python devs ask all people how to name things before, and then Guido
V. R. picks the most popular name. They do this because a single
person may have some bias: what is intuitive for a person (like
Guido, or Walter, or Andrei) may be not intuitive for most other
people. Choosing one of the most popular choices can't solve all
problems, but it helps finding a name/syntax that will result
intuitive for most future programmers.
Bye, bearophile
The discussion on the name is here:
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/archives/digitalmars/D/transporting_qualifier_from_parameter_to_the_return_value_103609.html
And no, it was not random.
Walter Bright:
And no, it was not random.
Sorry for showing disrespect for your work, it has slipped me. I have used a
wrong wording.
Do you see a correlation between the "inout" word and the semantics of this
feature? I think this connection is not intuitive.
What are the alternative words that can be used here? Are those a worse choice?
What are the most intuitive words for most people? Is this feature worth
introducing a keyword?
Bye,
bearophile
Sönke Ludwig wrote:
Am 31.12.2009 19:48, schrieb Walter Bright:
Happy New Year!
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/1.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.1.054.zip
http://www.digitalmars.com/d/2.0/changelog.html
http://ftp.digitalmars.com/dmd.2.038.zip
Many thanks to the numerous people who contributed to this update.
Great to see so many fixes that make the language much more hassle-free
to use - especially for newcomers that hit such things for the first
time. However, I have at least one blocker problem in this release:
Because of the now disallowed struct initializers for structs with
constructors (bug 3476), there is no way to use those structs as static
immutable values as the constructors are not CTFE processable.
(-> Error: cannot evaluate ((X __ctmp2;
) , __ctmp2).this() at compile time)
This problem has been there since struct constructors have been
introduced. A quick search on bugzilla did not return a matching
bug report, only some other issues related to struct constructors. I'll
file a bug report if noone else knows of any existing one (technically
this would be an 'improvement', but I think it is a really important
issue).
Bug 3535.
There are still several bugs related to struct constructors.
Workaround is to use static opCall instead of a constructor.
Thanks a lot everybody. Also special thanks to Don for his increased
involvement and stepping up to help with some serious bugfixing!
It feels like D2 is becoming more solid and usable every release in
spite of major features still being added.
Happy new year! It will be an exciting one for D.
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