www.digitalmars.com         C & C++   DMDScript  

digitalmars.D - Rebuild - an annoying feature

reply Ty Tower <tytower hotmail.com.au> writes:
Alright so its rebuild's fault
Good - Where can it be going wrong?
Ty Tower wrote:
 Gregor Richards Wrote:

 Ty Tower wrote:
 DSSS is looking pretty good as a builder but one thing that wastes my time is
if it hangs up somewhere building a list of say 30 files I go back fix the
problem and then issue build again .
 Dsss then instantly wipes what has been compiled already and starts again !

 Is there a way to make it ignore work already done if you want it to ?

opposite of the truth. - Gregor Richards

OK so mine IS doing this, which apparently it should not I have been building dwt-examples and I have watched it start again 4 times so far today, It has done so since I started that's why its an annoying feature . Perhaps something happened in the latest updates? then I remade the dsss.conf file and deleted what had been already compiled and used that to avoid the issue.

Perhaps the confusion is in the fact that DSSS does in fact issue rebuild commands every time. rebuild itself does not build anything that's already been built. - Gregor Richards The confusion is with the whole "D" lot -for Linux its a bloody frightful mess
Mar 09 2008
parent reply Ty Tower <tytower hotmail.com.au> writes:
Yes well it seems it is still yours Gregor. I don't see anything here to alter
that behaviour anyway so it must be a preset default. So why would it be doing
the opposite?
Your credibility to future users is on the line here !

[tytower linuxbox ~]$ rebuild --help
ReBuild version 0.75 (based on DMD 2.008)
Copyright (c) 1999-2007 by Digital Mars and Gregor Richards written by Walter
Bright and Gregor Richards
Documentation: http://www.digitalmars.com/d/index.html
Usage:
  rebuild files.d ... { -switch }

  files.d        D source files
  -rf<filename>  Use specified response file
  -dc=<compiler> use the specified compiler configuration
  -p             do not compile (or link)
  -c             do not link
  -D             generate documentation
  -Dddocdir      write documentation files to docdir directory
  -Dffilename    write documentation file to filename
  -Dqdocdir      write documentation files to docdir directory with
                 fully-qualified file names
  -lib           link a static library
  -libs-safe     exit failure or success for whether libraries can be safely
                 be used with any D code
  -shlib         link a shared library
  -shlib-support exit failure or success for whether shared libraries are
                 supported
  -dylib         link a dynamic library (a library intended to be loaded at
                 runtime)
  -dylib-support exit failure or success for whether dynamic libraries are
                 supported
  -debuglib=name    set symbolic debug library to name
  -defaultlib=name  set default library to name
  -g             add symbolic debug info
  -gc            add symbolic debug info, pretend to be C
  -files         list files which would be compiled (but don't compile)
  -notfound      list files which are imported, but do not exist (and don't
                 compile)
  -objfiles      list object files generated
  -keeprfiles    Keep response files (if they are used)
  -full          compile all source files, regardless of their age
  -explicit      only compile files explicitly named, not dependencies
  --help         print help
  -Ipath         where to look for imports
  -Ccompileflag  pass compileflag to compilation
  -Llinkerflag   pass linkerflag to the linker at link time
  -Klinkerflag   pass linkerflag to the compiler at link time
  -ll<lib>       link in the specified library
                 Windows: Link to <lib>.lib
                 Posix: Link to lib<lib>.{a,so}
  -Spath         search path for libraries
  -O             optimize
  -oqobjdir      write object files to directory objdir with fully-qualified
                 module names
  -odobjdir      write object files to directory objdir
  -offilename    name output file to filename
  -quiet         suppress unnecessary messages
  -release       compile release version
  -exec          run resulting program
  -v             verbose
  -n             just list the commands to be run, don't run them
  -version=level compile in version code >= level
  -version=ident compile in version code identified by ident
  -debug         compile in debug code
  -debug=level   compile in debug code <= level
  -debug=ident   compile in debug code identified by ident
  -clean         remove object files after done building
  -no-export-dynamic do not export dynamic symbols. Dynamic symbols are
                 exported by default on POSIX to support .so files
  -circular      allow circular dependencies to work on some compilers (namely
                 GDC)
  -testversion=<version>
                 exit failure or success for whether the specified version is
                 defined
  -reflect       use drefgen to make rodin-compatible reflections of all
                 included modules
  -candydoc      generate the modules.ddoc file for candydoc (must specify -Dq)
  All other flags are passed to the compiler.
Mar 09 2008
parent reply Ty Tower <tytower hotmail.com.au> writes:
I don't see anything wrong in jesse's dsss.conf file either
The commented out files have problems

[*]
debugflags+=-g -gc -debug

#used for dwtsnippets/text/Snippet258
#dwtsnippets/expandbar/Snippet223
buildflags+=-Jdwtsnippets/images

version(Windows){
    #buildflags+= -L/SUBSYSTEM:windows:5
    buildflags+= -L/SUBSYSTEM:console:5
}

# It seems this is no longer needed
# The linker error work around
# This is only needed if Tango was
# installed with DSSS
#version(linux){
#    buildflags+= -L-lDD-tango-util
#}

[dwtexamples/simple.d]
#[dwtexamples/clipboard/ClipboardExample.d]
[dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld1.d]
[dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld2.d]
[dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld3.d]
[dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld4.d]
[dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld5.d]

[dwtsnippets/button/Snippet293.d]
[dwtsnippets/combo/Snippet26.d]
[dwtsnippets/composite/Snippet9.d]
[dwtsnippets/coolbar/Snippet20.d]
[dwtsnippets/ctabfolder/Snippet165.d]
[dwtsnippets/directorydialog/Snippet33.d]
[dwtsnippets/expandbar/Snippet223.d]
[dwtsnippets/menu/Snippet29.d]
[dwtsnippets/menu/Snippet97.d]
[dwtsnippets/sash/Snippet107.d]
[dwtsnippets/styledtext/Snippet163.d]
[dwtsnippets/styledtext/Snippet189.d]
[dwtsnippets/table/Snippet38.d]
[dwtsnippets/table/Snippet144.d]
[dwtsnippets/text/Snippet258.d]
[dwtsnippets/tooltips/Snippet41.d]
[dwtsnippets/tray/Snippet143.d]
[dwtsnippets/tree/Snippet8.d]
[dwtsnippets/tree/Snippet15.d]
#[dwtsnippets/program/Snippet32.d]

#[user/dragdrop/texttolabel.d]
[user/drawingboard/DrawingBoard.d]
[user/torhu_synctest.d]

version(Derelict){
[dwtsnippets/opengl/Snippet195.d]
}

[dwtexamples/addressbook/AddressBook.d]
buildflags+=-g -gc -debug
version(Windows){
    buildflags+= -L/SUBSYSTEM:console:5
}
buildflags+=-Jdwtexamples/addressbook

[dwtexamples/controlexample/ControlExample.d]
buildflags+=-g -gc -debug
version(Windows){
    buildflags+= -L/SUBSYSTEM:console:5
}
buildflags+=-Jdwtexamples/controlexample
buildflags+=-version=CONTROL_EXAMPLE_MAIN

[dwtexamples/controlexample/CustomControlExample.d]
buildflags+=-g -gc -debug
version(Windows){
    buildflags+= -L/SUBSYSTEM:console:5
}
buildflags+=-Jdwtexamples/controlexample
buildflags+=-version=CUSTOM_CONTROL_EXAMPLE_MAIN

[dwtexamples/texteditor/TextEditor.d]
buildflags+=-g -gc -debug
version(Windows){
    buildflags+= -L/SUBSYSTEM:console:5
}
buildflags+=-Jdwtexamples/texteditor
Mar 09 2008
parent reply Ty Tower <tytower hotmail.com.au> writes:
Pity I can't just add to the old posts still....

Here is output showing it removing the old executeables

[tytower linuxbox dwt-samples-200a229be5ca]$ dsss build
Default prefix /usr is unwritable, using /home/tytower/d instead.

Removing dwtexamples/simple

Removing dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld1

Removing dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld2

Removing dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld3

Removing dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld4

Removing dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld5

Removing dwtsnippets/button/Snippet293

Removing dwtsnippets/combo/Snippet26

Removing dwtsnippets/composite/Snippet9

Removing dwtsnippets/coolbar/Snippet20

Removing dwtsnippets/ctabfolder/Snippet165

Removing dwtsnippets/directorydialog/Snippet33

Removing dwtsnippets/expandbar/Snippet223

Removing dwtsnippets/menu/Snippet29

Removing dwtsnippets/menu/Snippet97

Removing dwtsnippets/sash/Snippet107

Removing dwtsnippets/styledtext/Snippet163

Removing dwtsnippets/styledtext/Snippet189

Removing dwtsnippets/table/Snippet38

Removing dwtsnippets/table/Snippet144

Removing dwtsnippets/text/Snippet258

Removing dwtsnippets/tooltips/Snippet41

Removing dwtsnippets/tray/Snippet143

Removing dwtsnippets/tree/Snippet8

Removing dwtsnippets/tree/Snippet15

Removing user/drawingboard/DrawingBoard

Removing user/torhu_synctest

Removing dwtexamples/addressbook/AddressBook

Removing dwtexamples/controlexample/ControlExample

Removing dwtexamples/controlexample/CustomControlExample

Removing dwtexamples/texteditor/TextEditor
Mar 09 2008
parent reply Gregor Richards <Richards codu.org> writes:
Ty Tower wrote:
 Pity I can't just add to the old posts still....
 
 Here is output showing it removing the old executeables
 
 [tytower linuxbox dwt-samples-200a229be5ca]$ dsss build
 Default prefix /usr is unwritable, using /home/tytower/d instead.
 
 Removing dwtexamples/simple
 
 Removing dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld1
 
 Removing dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld2
 
 Removing dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld3
 
 Removing dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld4
 
 Removing dwtexamples/helloworld/HelloWorld5
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/button/Snippet293
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/combo/Snippet26
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/composite/Snippet9
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/coolbar/Snippet20
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/ctabfolder/Snippet165
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/directorydialog/Snippet33
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/expandbar/Snippet223
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/menu/Snippet29
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/menu/Snippet97
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/sash/Snippet107
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/styledtext/Snippet163
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/styledtext/Snippet189
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/table/Snippet38
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/table/Snippet144
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/text/Snippet258
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/tooltips/Snippet41
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/tray/Snippet143
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/tree/Snippet8
 
 Removing dwtsnippets/tree/Snippet15
 
 Removing user/drawingboard/DrawingBoard
 
 Removing user/torhu_synctest
 
 Removing dwtexamples/addressbook/AddressBook
 
 Removing dwtexamples/controlexample/ControlExample
 
 Removing dwtexamples/controlexample/CustomControlExample
 
 Removing dwtexamples/texteditor/TextEditor
 

Is this after you changed dsss.conf? Everything is cleaned up after changing dsss.conf, since it doesn't know if the changes will alter the build in a non-backwards-compatible way.
 The confusion is with the whole "D" lot -for Linux its a bloody
 frightful mess

No, the confusion is not with the whole D community, it's you. We (by which I mean the D community) seem to be in agreement that you're just an idiot. You ask extremely vague questions without describing the scenario at all, and then when you're asked to describe the scenario, you describe something utterly irrelevant. Gee, I could have actually given a useful response if you had posted a log in the first place, but that's what a sensible person would have done. The D community is small and always needs more people, but we don't need morons. - Gregor Richards
Mar 09 2008
parent reply Ty Tower <tytower hotmail.com.au> writes:
Gregor Richards Wrote:
 but he's not too smart ,I see why the problems and why so few users 

Keep covering your arse son and some fools will believe you and persevere.
100 or so users in 4 years -not doing too well son
Mar 10 2008
next sibling parent Alexander Panek <alexander.panek brainsware.org> writes:
Ty Tower wrote:
 Gregor Richards Wrote:
  but he's not too smart ,I see why the problems and why so few users 
 
 Keep covering your arse son and some fools will believe you and persevere.
 100 or so users in 4 years -not doing too well son

Wash your tongue. Also, I don't see where Gregor wrote "but he's not too smart ,I see why the prolems and why so few users". You fail, seriously, in all ways possible. DSSS and rebuild are operating completely correct. Just because you don't get how to use it, doesn't mean it's not working properly. So either you go read the fine manual, or you can pretty much go to hell. Being a smart-ass without any sort of knowledge to back it is kind of stupid.
Mar 10 2008
prev sibling next sibling parent Robert Fraser <fraserofthenight gmail.com> writes:
Ty Tower wrote:
 Gregor Richards Wrote:
  but he's not too smart ,I see why the problems and why so few users 

lol, no he didn't. ^_^ you fail, please try again.
Mar 10 2008
prev sibling next sibling parent "Jb" <jb nowhere.com> writes:
"Ty Tower" <tytower hotmail.com.au> wrote in message 
news:fr2r6r$1brv$1 digitalmars.com...
 Gregor Richards Wrote:
 but he's not too smart ,I see why the problems and why so few users

 Keep covering your arse son and some fools will believe you and persevere.
 100 or so users in 4 years -not doing too well son

They let you download and use their software for free, they even try to help you for free. And all you do is act like a spoilt child who thinks the whole world owes you somthing. It doesnt. If you cant be polite, then you will always be shunned on any adult programing forum. I suspect with your attitude you probably experience that in many areas of your life. So i sugest you grow up.. or else.. http://img357.imageshack.us/img357/2787/fail2it9.jpg
Mar 10 2008
prev sibling parent reply "Neil Vice" <psgdg swiftdsl.com.au> writes:
"Ty Tower" <tytower hotmail.com.au> wrote in message 
news:fr2r6r$1brv$1 digitalmars.com...
 Gregor Richards Wrote:
 but he's not too smart ,I see why the problems and why so few users

 Keep covering your arse son and some fools will believe you and persevere.
 100 or so users in 4 years -not doing too well son

I must admit I have been very frustrated with D at times as I expected too much of an alpha version (D2 is still considered alpha yes?) that I understand now is still under heavy development and I have been very pleased by the changes I've seen particularly in 2.011 and 2.012. I have found myself using D after having been disappointed by many other languages, fussy as I am. Given the amount of criticism you appear to have of D, related projects and the people involved I have to ask, why then are you using it?
Mar 10 2008
parent reply Ty Tower <tytower hotmail.com.au> writes:
Neil Vice Wrote:

 "Ty Tower" <tytower hotmail.com.au> wrote in message 
 news:fr2r6r$1brv$1 digitalmars.com...
 Gregor Richards Wrote:
 but he's not too smart ,I see why the problems and why so few users

 Keep covering your arse son and some fools will believe you and persevere.
 100 or so users in 4 years -not doing too well son

I must admit I have been very frustrated with D at times as I expected too much of an alpha version (D2 is still considered alpha yes?) that I understand now is still under heavy development and I have been very pleased by the changes I've seen particularly in 2.011 and 2.012. I have found myself using D after having been disappointed by many other languages, fussy as I am. Given the amount of criticism you appear to have of D, related projects and the people involved I have to ask, why then are you using it?

Thats a fair question I'm not using it . I hav'nt been able to use it as I have not been satisfied with the stability of what I have downloaded. I hav'nt used 2.xx yet I'm still on 1.XX So I am experimenting with "D" . In fact I am now looking and learning because I have wasted so much time trying to get it to a useable state I will now become an ardent critic of "D" in "C" forums-good critics know thei subject matter Note that the support for Windows users is probably a lot better as the distributed .exe files have to be right . I suspect the problem is with Linux/Unix where the download must be compiled and there are so few user in this category that no one has looked at this fully yet . I originally looked at "D" and thought it was worth knowing about . Getting into it I intended to write a program which needed SWT or something like it . If you look there is nothing stable for Unix so I went to dwt which is "alpha". Well since then - what a mess. Thats why I am critical and the Tango /Phobos calamity is simply stupid in its present form for Linux Honestly wherever I go in "D" I find problems . That means it comes from the heads of the organisation. They are not going to be Google type millionaires I can tell you. Cheers
Mar 10 2008
next sibling parent BCS <ao pathlink.com> writes:
Reply to ty,

I suspect the problem is
 with Linux/Unix where the download must be compiled and there are so
 few user in this category that no one has looked at this fully yet .
 

DMD works out of the box on every linux box I've tried. Might you be talking about DSSS? It is developed on linux IIRC. Or are you talking about somthing else?
 
  They are not going to be Google type millionaires I can tell you.
 

Last time I check, they didn't want to be either.
Mar 10 2008
prev sibling next sibling parent reply "Neil Vice" <psgdg swiftdsl.com.au> writes:
"Ty Tower" <tytower hotmail.com.au> wrote:
 Thats a fair question
 I'm not using it . I hav'nt been able to use it as I have not been 
 satisfied with the stability of what I have downloaded.
 I hav'nt used 2.xx yet I'm still on 1.XX
 So I am experimenting with "D" . In fact I am now looking and learning 
 because I have wasted so much time trying to get it to a useable state I 
 will now become an ardent critic of "D" in "C" forums-good critics know 
 thei subject matter

I don't recall you having any gripes with D as a programming language. Your issues seem to be with 3rd-party open-source libraries and tools contributed by the D community. Allow me to attempt to address them individually. Firstly, I also dislike DSSS and rebuild. I don't recall particular criticisms with them and I certainly feel no ill will towards the developers =) However, particularly the fact that rebuild is/was slow to support significant front-end changes in D2 I couldn't wait for it to catch up. What do you use to build C code? Make? Make will work just fine with D as well... my preference happens to be 'cook' but either way - a criticism of rebuild is not a criticism of D any more than a criticism of Make is a criticism of C. As for DWT, a quick visit to the DSource DWT site would indicate that the project is still under development. Given this, should you not expect some issues? Having said that, as an experiment I am very tempted to install linux (Debian being my distribution of choice) and attempt to get the DWT examples working to see whether your outrage is justified.
 Note that the support for Windows users is probably a lot better as the 
 distributed .exe files have to be right . I suspect the problem is with 
 Linux/Unix where the download must be compiled and there are so few user 
 in this category that no one has looked at this fully yet .

It would greatly surprise me if there were not many linux D users. I would have expected linux users to be more willing to "experiment" with a new language like D as a rule... In my experience, doing the same thing under Windows and linux, where a tool is available under Windows to perform the task, usually requires a bit more effort/patience under linux. That's not to say that the result isn't worth the wait, but the very fact that compilation is often required means that there is more room for error. How long have you been a linux user? I'd be surprised if you hadn't experienced similar difficulties using applications other than DMD.
 I originally looked at "D" and thought it was worth knowing about . 
 Getting into it I intended to write a program which needed SWT or 
 something like it . If you look there is nothing stable for Unix so I went 
 to dwt which is "alpha".

And what windowing toolkit comes out-of-the-box with C exactly? I'm not saying that they don't exist... but were they written in the 70s by Ritchie et. al.? These things take time and are not part of the core language by any means. Certainly if you require RAD GUI tools D may not be the language for you... at least perhaps not yet. Having said that I would also have thought that C would have been a poor choice, prefering C# or Java perhaps. I am personally using D to write a game engine (in theory =P) and short of the sort of bugs and const design issues discussed in this NG I have been very happy with the language. I am a C++ fan and have been impressed that D has provided the power of C++ without the redundancy of syntax (header files) and added many useful modern programming tools. I happen to dislike both standard libraries and personally think it was a poor choice on the part of the Tango developers to break compatibility with Phobos (though this may have been resolved recently?) but I'm a reinvent-the-wheel kind of a guy anyway and D has allowed me to do so in very elegant ways IMHO.
 Well since then - what a mess. Thats why I am critical and the Tango 
 /Phobos calamity is simply stupid in its present form for Linux

 Honestly wherever I go in "D" I find problems . That means it comes from 
 the heads of the organisation. They are not going to be Google type 
 millionaires I can tell you.

Perhaps your Google comment was simply sarcasm and nothing more, however as BCS says, profit is not the motivation behind D. The very fact that such an excellent tool has been developed non-commercially by what I understand to be a rather small group of people is a testament to the Walter's (and others') skill and dedication and I am personally very grateful. Yes there is much room for improvement, but show me another language with the first compiler released last year which meets your criterea? You are clearly expecting D to be something it's not, however that's not to say that the problems you have encountered are insurmountable. Each tool is not suited to every task, but that doesn't make them lesser tools. As far as your comments regarding "good critics" go, I'm not sure that you can be in a position to be critical until you have at least got something working. When I first used D I was critical of some of the design decisions in the language to the point that I would rant at coworkers in frustration =) Since then however, I have read excellent explanations behind these decisions on this very NG and have learned the error of my ways. The very fact that some clearly intelligent, experienced developers frequent this forum and have positive things to say about D suggests to me that something must be being done right - and I for one am keen to learn more. I hope you can find D more useful on another project. Having said that, if you are still interested in working with DWT under linux, I could be convinced to attempt it myself and detail my results. Neil
Mar 10 2008
parent reply Ty Tower <tytower hotmail.com.au> writes:
Neil Vice Wrote:

 "Ty Tower" <tytower hotmail.com.au> wrote:
 Thats a fair question
 I'm not using it . I hav'nt been able to use it as I have not been 
 satisfied with the stability of what I have downloaded.
 I hav'nt used 2.xx yet I'm still on 1.XX
 So I am experimenting with "D" . In fact I am now looking and learning 
 because I have wasted so much time trying to get it to a useable state I 
 will now become an ardent critic of "D" in "C" forums-good critics know 
 thei subject matter

I don't recall you having any gripes with D as a programming language. Your issues seem to be with 3rd-party open-source libraries and tools contributed by the D community. Allow me to attempt to address them individually. Firstly, I also dislike DSSS and rebuild. I don't recall particular criticisms with them and I certainly feel no ill will towards the developers =) However, particularly the fact that rebuild is/was slow to support significant front-end changes in D2 I couldn't wait for it to catch up. What do you use to build C code? Make? Make will work just fine with D as well... my preference happens to be 'cook' but either way - a criticism of rebuild is not a criticism of D any more than a criticism of Make is a criticism of C. As for DWT, a quick visit to the DSource DWT site would indicate that the project is still under development. Given this, should you not expect some issues? Having said that, as an experiment I am very tempted to install linux (Debian being my distribution of choice) and attempt to get the DWT examples working to see whether your outrage is justified.
 Note that the support for Windows users is probably a lot better as the 
 distributed .exe files have to be right . I suspect the problem is with 
 Linux/Unix where the download must be compiled and there are so few user 
 in this category that no one has looked at this fully yet .

It would greatly surprise me if there were not many linux D users. I would have expected linux users to be more willing to "experiment" with a new language like D as a rule... In my experience, doing the same thing under Windows and linux, where a tool is available under Windows to perform the task, usually requires a bit more effort/patience under linux. That's not to say that the result isn't worth the wait, but the very fact that compilation is often required means that there is more room for error. How long have you been a linux user? I'd be surprised if you hadn't experienced similar difficulties using applications other than DMD.
 I originally looked at "D" and thought it was worth knowing about . 
 Getting into it I intended to write a program which needed SWT or 
 something like it . If you look there is nothing stable for Unix so I went 
 to dwt which is "alpha".

And what windowing toolkit comes out-of-the-box with C exactly? I'm not saying that they don't exist... but were they written in the 70s by Ritchie et. al.? These things take time and are not part of the core language by any means. Certainly if you require RAD GUI tools D may not be the language for you... at least perhaps not yet. Having said that I would also have thought that C would have been a poor choice, prefering C# or Java perhaps. I am personally using D to write a game engine (in theory =P) and short of the sort of bugs and const design issues discussed in this NG I have been very happy with the language. I am a C++ fan and have been impressed that D has provided the power of C++ without the redundancy of syntax (header files) and added many useful modern programming tools. I happen to dislike both standard libraries and personally think it was a poor choice on the part of the Tango developers to break compatibility with Phobos (though this may have been resolved recently?) but I'm a reinvent-the-wheel kind of a guy anyway and D has allowed me to do so in very elegant ways IMHO.
 Well since then - what a mess. Thats why I am critical and the Tango 
 /Phobos calamity is simply stupid in its present form for Linux

 Honestly wherever I go in "D" I find problems . That means it comes from 
 the heads of the organisation. They are not going to be Google type 
 millionaires I can tell you.

Perhaps your Google comment was simply sarcasm and nothing more, however as BCS says, profit is not the motivation behind D. The very fact that such an excellent tool has been developed non-commercially by what I understand to be a rather small group of people is a testament to the Walter's (and others') skill and dedication and I am personally very grateful. Yes there is much room for improvement, but show me another language with the first compiler released last year which meets your criterea? You are clearly expecting D to be something it's not, however that's not to say that the problems you have encountered are insurmountable. Each tool is not suited to every task, but that doesn't make them lesser tools. As far as your comments regarding "good critics" go, I'm not sure that you can be in a position to be critical until you have at least got something working. When I first used D I was critical of some of the design decisions in the language to the point that I would rant at coworkers in frustration =) Since then however, I have read excellent explanations behind these decisions on this very NG and have learned the error of my ways. The very fact that some clearly intelligent, experienced developers frequent this forum and have positive things to say about D suggests to me that something must be being done right - and I for one am keen to learn more. I hope you can find D more useful on another project. Having said that, if you are still interested in working with DWT under linux, I could be convinced to attempt it myself and detail my results. Neil

Interesting read Neil and nothing there I could not agree with -Thanks I have dwt working and am experimenting -Its worth the look and I do like the "D" language itself. I'm not knowledgeable enough to say but isn't dmd just a wrapped up gcc? Anyway no matter , its rebuild wrapped as dsss thats giving me problems and getting good installation notes from digitalmars and tango. All of D Tango Phobos dwt was new for me a month ago and the old configure ,make ,make install always worked for me . I must have had failures but only back at least 5 years ago Cheers
Mar 11 2008
parent "Neil Vice" <sardonicpresence gmail.com> writes:
"Ty Tower" <tytower hotmail.com.au> wrote:
 Interesting read Neil and nothing there I could not agree with -Thanks

I am pleased to hear that.
 I have dwt working and am experimenting -Its worth the look and I do like 
 the "D"  language itself.

Good to hear things are working in the end.
 I'm not knowledgeable enough to say but isn't dmd just a wrapped up gcc?

Well, depending on exactly what you mean I suggest that that is not the case at all. DMD (and associated OPTLINK) as I understand it have been written from scratch by Walter, at least in part based on his previous work on C and C++ compilers: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Bright Both being compilers, GCC (or more correctly GDC in the case of D) and DMD certainly perform the same task but the code is completely independant, with the exception of the shared front-end in the case of GDC - where GDC has borrowed from DMD not the other way around.
 Anyway no matter , its rebuild wrapped as dsss thats giving me problems 
 and getting good installation notes from digitalmars and tango. All of D 
 Tango Phobos dwt was new for me a month ago and the old configure ,make 
 ,make install always worked for me . I must have had failures but only 
 back at least 5 years ago

I admit I haven't attempted to build anyone elses code (e.g. the DWT examples) but except for a couple of snags I haven't had much issue building my own. As far as installation goes, I had a couple of false starts but once I realised you can just dump the "dm" and "dmd" directories under e.g. /usr and just put /usr/dmd/bin in your PATH then I have had no troubles at all. Again I haven't worked with Tango though. As I indicated previously, I had some issues with rebuild and dsss. I recall now that I had some issues with files not being rebuilt unless I explicitly "touch"ed them or something and as such went back to 'make' and 'cook' - just my personal preference I think. I did have some linking issues where DMD didn't generate the odd symbol if I compiled all source files in one build, rather than seperate builds with -c then a seperate linking step - presumably a compiler bug - but now I've got my own build environment set-up I can get on with coding in D =)
Mar 11 2008
prev sibling parent reply Brian Hay <bhay construct3d.com> writes:
Ty Tower wrote:
 I will now become an ardent critic of "D" in "C" forums

Well good luck with that. If you treat the people on other programming forums with the same disrespect and immaturity you've repeatedly demonstrated here I can't imagine you'll be made welcome for very long.
 Honestly wherever I go in "D" I find problems. 

People will find problems anywhere if they look hard enough and it seems as though you've come here with that express intention. I'm a comparative newbie to compiled languages and if I can start working with D quickly and enjoying every minute of it then anyone should be able to, especially someone like you who professes to have experience with C.
 That means it comes from the heads of the organisation.

You make it sound like D was conceived and developed by a corporate behemoth like Microsoft or Sun. D was conceived by one man, Walter Bright, and developed by him and a few others with extensive input and feedback from a dynamic, supportive and growing user community. I'm sorry you cannot see that and do not want to be a part of the magic.
Mar 10 2008
parent Ty Tower <tytower hotmail.com.au> writes:
Brian Hay Wrote:

 Ty Tower wrote:
 I will now become an ardent critic of "D" in "C" forums

Well good luck with that. If you treat the people on other programming forums with the same disrespect and immaturity you've repeatedly demonstrated here I can't imagine you'll be made welcome for very long.
 Honestly wherever I go in "D" I find problems. 

People will find problems anywhere if they look hard enough and it seems as though you've come here with that express intention. I'm a comparative newbie to compiled languages and if I can start working with D quickly and enjoying every minute of it then anyone should be able to, especially someone like you who professes to have experience with C.
 That means it comes from the heads of the organisation.

You make it sound like D was conceived and developed by a corporate behemoth like Microsoft or Sun. D was conceived by one man, Walter Bright, and developed by him and a few others with extensive input and feedback from a dynamic, supportive and growing user community. I'm sorry you cannot see that and do not want to be a part of the magic.

Well good luck with that.
Mar 11 2008