www.digitalmars.com         C & C++   DMDScript  

digitalmars.D - Dlang.org needs a "Getting Started" page

reply Xinok <xinok live.com> writes:
Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a Getting 
Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as effortless as 
possible by providing all the information and resources needed for one 
to dive right into D. Not everything needs to be covered by this page, 
but it should provide links as necessary.

Just to list some things that should be covered on this page (you can 
list more):

- Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
- Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
- Downloads
- List of IDEs / Editors that support D
- Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
- Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
- Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
- Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for configuring

Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of date!
Jan 30 2012
next sibling parent "Era Scarecrow" <rtcvb32 yahoo.com> writes:
On Tuesday, 31 January 2012 at 05:31:47 UTC, Xinok wrote:
 Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a 
 Getting Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as 
 effortless as possible by providing all the information and 
 resources needed for one to dive right into D. Not everything 
 needs to be covered by this page, but it should provide links 
 as necessary.

Hmmm, I would also think having a section of tutorials that steps you through the process, perhaps as a video on youtube? Course the tutorials I'm thinking is taking something and either converting C++ code, or making something original and then expanding it and the thought process on how to improve the code, adding generics and templates, writing a mixing function one step at a time. Adding a unittest to prove it works. Perhaps I'm thinking more of a walk-through lecture, since I don't want so much a wall of text as someone actually talking to me. It could do that for almost everything, explaining how a delegate would be useful and why it works, and a few good portions on text and string manipulation for unicode. So far the best examples on coding and whatnot were from a stanford university lecture and an introduction to the [b]STL[/b] from microsoft. Hmmm I also think perhaps adding a easy pdf download of the library reference you could print off; I find it increasingly annoying to switch back and forth on the html when I wouldn't mind having it in a paper form. But perhaps that's just me....
Jan 30 2012
prev sibling next sibling parent Iain Buclaw <ibuclaw ubuntu.com> writes:
On 31 January 2012 05:31, Xinok <xinok live.com> wrote:
 Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a Getting
 Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as effortless as
 possible by providing all the information and resources needed for one to
 dive right into D. Not everything needs to be covered by this page, but it
 should provide links as necessary.

 Just to list some things that should be covered on this page (you can list
 more):

 - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
 - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
 - Downloads
 - List of IDEs / Editors that support D
 - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
 - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
 - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
 - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for configuring

 Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of date!

I think it would be great if we had a beginners guide in the spirit of http://learnyouahaskell.com -- Iain Buclaw *(p < e ? p++ : p) = (c & 0x0f) + '0';
Jan 31 2012
prev sibling next sibling parent reply "Jesse Phillips" <jessekphillips+D gmail.com> writes:
On Tuesday, 31 January 2012 at 05:31:47 UTC, Xinok wrote:
 Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a 
 Getting Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as 
 effortless as possible by providing all the information and 
 resources needed for one to dive right into D. Not everything 
 needs to be covered by this page, but it should provide links 
 as necessary.

 Just to list some things that should be covered on this page 
 (you can list more):

 - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
 - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
 - Downloads
 - List of IDEs / Editors that support D
 - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
 - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
 - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
 - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for 
 configuring

 Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of 
 date!

Well, this is how Wiki4D[1] is set up. Actually that is basically all it is. I think you list is way to long for a single page. Improvements are welcome, it is maintained by anyone willing to look at it, including DigitalMars. 1. http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?FrontPage
Jan 31 2012
parent Xinok <xinok live.com> writes:
On 1/31/2012 10:45 AM, Jesse Phillips wrote:
 Well, this is how Wiki4D[1] is set up. Actually that is basically all it
 is. I think you list is way to long for a single page. Improvements are
 welcome, it is maintained by anyone willing to look at it, including
 DigitalMars.

 1. http://www.prowiki.org/wiki4d/wiki.cgi?FrontPage

The problem is that newcomers shouldn't have to hunt for this information. While that link could suffice, it's simply unprofessional to force them to jump between websites to find the information they need. There needs to be an obvious place, a single well-structured page on the official website with everything they need to know to get started.
Jan 31 2012
prev sibling next sibling parent reply "Jesse Phillips" <jessekphillips+D gmail.com> writes:
As I mentioned I think this list is too much for one page, it is 
just overwhelming.

 - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.

This would be nice, but it too easy to be bias in describing the situation, especially since it exists only for D 1.x which is being phased out.
 - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)

There are links found when you select Tools & Downloads.
 - Downloads

In the Tools & Downloads link.
 - List of IDEs / Editors that support D

This list is overwhelming, subjective, and a link is provided to Wiki4D from Tools & Downloads.
 - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D

There is a link to the Tutorial chapter of "The D Programming Language" under Documentation.
 - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D

Under Community there is a Links link, that is not well maintained.
 - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)

Under Links.
 - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for 
 configuring

Community contains a link for Forms, or actually the Newsgroups and provides the web interface for those not setting up a client. Yes this needs updated and DFeed needs to move to d-programming-language.org.
 Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of 
 date!

No, update the pages that exist, and keep them up to date.
Jan 31 2012
parent Xinok <xinok live.com> writes:
On 1/31/2012 11:47 AM, Jesse Phillips wrote:
 As I mentioned I think this list is too much for one page, it is just
 overwhelming.

It doesn't have to be a wall of text. If done right, it would be a well-structured page split up into sections which is easy to navigate and find the information one would want. Something I didn't make clear, I think it's okay to provide links to other pages (in moderation, let's not just have a page full of links), as long as those pages aren't out of date.
 - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.

This would be nice, but it too easy to be bias in describing the situation, especially since it exists only for D 1.x which is being phased out.

I don't see how it would be biased. Phobos is the official standard library, Tango is a third-party standard library which is for D 1.x only. D 2.x is the latest version while D 1.x is being phased out and will be maintained until the end of 2012.
 - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)

There are links found when you select Tools & Downloads.

It doesn't provide any explanation though. The information is scattered everywhere, you have to go hunting for it which only adds to the confusion.
 - List of IDEs / Editors that support D

This list is overwhelming, subjective, and a link is provided to Wiki4D from Tools & Downloads.

As I mentioned above, I think it's okay to provide a link rather than having a large list. Perhaps it would be best to list a few popular editors (DDT, VisualD) and provide that link for the rest.
 - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D

There is a link to the Tutorial chapter of "The D Programming Language" under Documentation.

Once again, information is scattered and you have to go looking for it. There's also other learning materials for D which aren't linked to anywhere AFAIK.
 - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D

Under Community there is a Links link, that is not well maintained.
 - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)

Under Links.

The list is very out of date, and "links" at the bottom of the page is not an obvious place to look for this information.
 - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for configuring

Community contains a link for Forms, or actually the Newsgroups and provides the web interface for those not setting up a client. Yes this needs updated and DFeed needs to move to d-programming-language.org.
 Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of date!

No, update the pages that exist, and keep them up to date.

Ideally, the website would be maintained and easier to navigate. However, it doesn't seem to be a high priority or else it would be done already. At least this way, it's a single page which could be put up in less than a day and is little effort to maintain. It's an obvious place to look as well ("Getting Started", who wouldn't look there first?). This page would serve as a single entry point which would help newcomers: - Download and install the compiler - Download / Configure an IDE or Editor - Write and Compile their first program - Find learning materials - Find resources such as libraries and debuggers - Get them involved in the community - Participate in the development of D That sounds worth it to me.
Jan 31 2012
prev sibling next sibling parent reply "Mattbeui" <matheus_nab hotmail.com> writes:
On Tuesday, 31 January 2012 at 05:31:47 UTC, Xinok wrote:
 Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a 
 Getting Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as 
 effortless as possible by providing all the information and 
 resources needed for one to dive right into D. Not everything 
 needs to be covered by this page, but it should provide links 
 as necessary.

 Just to list some things that should be covered on this page 
 (you can list more):

 - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
 - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
 - Downloads
 - List of IDEs / Editors that support D
 - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
 - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
 - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
 - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for 
 configuring

 Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of 
 date!

That would be a dream, really! In fact, you can find some information about this topics on the website in some places, but the main question is why not group them all in one place for the beginners. I felt and still feel a bit lost with D. So, I enter everyday on this NG to understand things a bit. But I think the things should be more friendly.
Jan 31 2012
parent deadalnix <deadalnix gmail.com> writes:
Le 31/01/2012 20:01, Mattbeui a écrit :
 On Tuesday, 31 January 2012 at 05:31:47 UTC, Xinok wrote:
 Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a
 Getting Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as
 effortless as possible by providing all the information and resources
 needed for one to dive right into D. Not everything needs to be
 covered by this page, but it should provide links as necessary.

 Just to list some things that should be covered on this page (you can
 list more):

 - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
 - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
 - Downloads
 - List of IDEs / Editors that support D
 - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
 - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
 - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
 - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for configuring

 Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of date!

That would be a dream, really! In fact, you can find some information about this topics on the website in some places, but the main question is why not group them all in one place for the beginners. I felt and still feel a bit lost with D. So, I enter everyday on this NG to understand things a bit. But I think the things should be more friendly.

Definitively. I think the first step should be to get rid of deprected stuffs (maybe reenable them with compiler switch). The second thing is to make the toolchain more reliable. The problem with this tutorial, in the current state of things, is that it would have to introduce deprecated stuffs, or that the newcomer can encounter compiler/phobos bugs even when using valid things. Think of toString on a const object, this a legitimate thing to do and avery newcomer will try it as soon as they know about const or about object (depending on which one is presented first).
Feb 01 2012
prev sibling next sibling parent Iain Buclaw <ibuclaw ubuntu.com> writes:
On 1 February 2012 17:08, deadalnix <deadalnix gmail.com> wrote:
 Le 31/01/2012 20:01, Mattbeui a =E9crit :

 On Tuesday, 31 January 2012 at 05:31:47 UTC, Xinok wrote:
 Just a thought, but I think the official website really needs a
 Getting Started page for newcomers. This page should make it as
 effortless as possible by providing all the information and resources
 needed for one to dive right into D. Not everything needs to be
 covered by this page, but it should provide links as necessary.

 Just to list some things that should be covered on this page (you can
 list more):

 - Explanation of D 1.x, D 2.x, Phobos, and Tango.
 - Explanation and links to different compilers (DMD, GDC, etc)
 - Downloads
 - List of IDEs / Editors that support D
 - Tutorial: Writing and compiling a program in D
 - Books / Websites / Resources for learning D
 - Libraries for D (e.g. dsource.org)
 - Forums / Newsgroups / Newsgroup clients + instructions for configurin=



 Most importantly, maintain this page! Never let it get out of date!

That would be a dream, really! In fact, you can find some information about this topics on the website in some places, but the main question is why not group them all in one place for the beginners. I felt and still feel a bit lost with D. So, I enter everyday on this NG to understand things a bit. But I think the things should be more friendly.

Definitively. I think the first step should be to get rid of deprected stuffs (maybe reenable them with compiler switch).

I do believe phobos should be dropping a few functions this month if the pragma(msg) warnings I see when building prove to be correct. :) --=20 Iain Buclaw *(p < e ? p++ : p) =3D (c & 0x0f) + '0';
Feb 01 2012
prev sibling parent "Martin Nowak" <dawg dawgfoto.de> writes:
 I think it would be great if we had a beginners guide in the spirit of
 http://learnyouahaskell.com

Yeah that would be great. Extending rdmd to an interpreter a la ghci would be very nice too.
Feb 02 2012