digitalmars.D - Audio time-compression (Was: On 80 columns should (not) be enough for
- Ulrik Mikaelsson (10/22) Jan 31 2011 I KNEW I wasn't alone at this. My S.O. usually just rolls her eyes
- Walter Bright (6/33) Jan 31 2011 I think the problem is it either never occurred to Tivo or Youtube, or t...
- Ulrik Mikaelsson (8/17) Jan 31 2011 Perhaps, although I develop for STB:s at work, and I know how
- Walter Bright (2/3) Jan 31 2011 I thought that DSP's were programmable.
- Ulrik Mikaelsson (22/28) Jan 31 2011 I might be wrong, I hardly ever get to touch things that low-level,
- Walter Bright (4/29) Jan 31 2011 The real money for Tivo is not the box cost, but the recurring subscript...
- Nick Sabalausky (7/9) Jan 31 2011 That's really cool, and seems so obvious in retrospect.
- David Nadlinger (4/5) Jan 31 2011 http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7873211.html, it seems to apply to
- Nick Sabalausky (9/13) Jan 31 2011 It would have to be limited to video, the filing date is 2009 and this w...
- Tomek =?UTF-8?B?U293acWEc2tp?= (6/10) Jan 31 2011 There's a D implementation:
- bearophile (6/9) Jan 31 2011 And it too has a vec2 and vec3! :-)
- Bruno Medeiros (4/6) Feb 10 2011 Damn, pretty damn impressive!
2011/1/30 Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com>:People who use screen readers often crank up the playback rate to 2x. The software adjusts the pitch so it doesn't sound like the Chipmunks. I've often wondered why DVRs don't do this (I've sent the suggestion to Tivo, they ignored me). I'd like the option to play the news (or other talk shows) at a faster rate, with pitch adjustment. I've found I can watch Tivo at 3x with the closed captioning on, and can almost keep up. The problem with DVRs at any fast forward speed is they turn the sound off! Grrrr. A golden opportunity missed. I'd also love it if youtube etc. did this. It's so boring looking at youtube presentations because they talk so slow. I'd love a double speed youtube viewing option. Remember I posted this in case some troll tries to patent it.I KNEW I wasn't alone at this. My S.O. usually just rolls her eyes when I do this. (Tip: VLC does it for at least double-speed) I think the reason I.E. YouTube and Tivo don't do it is that AFAIU, it is fairly CPU-consuming (FFT back and forth?) In the TiVo-case, my guess is nobody paid for the hardware, and in the YouTube-case I doubt neither Flash nor JavaScript will enable the performance required. Perhaps it can be done browser-dependently with HTML5. Now, what we need is the audio-equivalent of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NcIJXTlugc
Jan 31 2011
Ulrik Mikaelsson wrote:2011/1/30 Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com>:I think the problem is it either never occurred to Tivo or Youtube, or they don't care about it. When I shut off my Tivo service, I told them that such a feature would entice me to keep it. But I seriously doubt they transmitted my idea to the right people.People who use screen readers often crank up the playback rate to 2x. The software adjusts the pitch so it doesn't sound like the Chipmunks. I've often wondered why DVRs don't do this (I've sent the suggestion to Tivo, they ignored me). I'd like the option to play the news (or other talk shows) at a faster rate, with pitch adjustment. I've found I can watch Tivo at 3x with the closed captioning on, and can almost keep up. The problem with DVRs at any fast forward speed is they turn the sound off! Grrrr. A golden opportunity missed. I'd also love it if youtube etc. did this. It's so boring looking at youtube presentations because they talk so slow. I'd love a double speed youtube viewing option. Remember I posted this in case some troll tries to patent it.I KNEW I wasn't alone at this. My S.O. usually just rolls her eyes when I do this. (Tip: VLC does it for at least double-speed) I think the reason I.E. YouTube and Tivo don't do it is that AFAIU, it is fairly CPU-consuming (FFT back and forth?) In the TiVo-case, my guess is nobody paid for the hardware, and in the YouTube-case I doubt neither Flash nor JavaScript will enable the performance required. Perhaps it can be done browser-dependently with HTML5.Now, what we need is the audio-equivalent of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NcIJXTlugcThat is an impressive algorithm!
Jan 31 2011
2011/1/31 Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com>:Perhaps, although I develop for STB:s at work, and I know how amazingly price-pressed the hardware is. Seriously, it's designed to show live HD, but the developers manual for one manufacturer, there's a performance-warning about animated GIF:s (not kidding). My guess is, the only FFT the box can manage is the one hard-coded in the video-chip, which can't easily be exploited for other means. Of course, I don't know what HW the Tivo is using, perhaps they're just lazy. :)I think the reason I.E. YouTube and Tivo don't do it is that AFAIU, it is fairly CPU-consuming (FFT back and forth?) In the TiVo-case, my guess is nobody paid for the hardware, and in the YouTube-case I doubt neither Flash nor JavaScript will enable the performance required. Perhaps it can be done browser-dependently with HTML5.I think the problem is it either never occurred to Tivo or Youtube, or they don't care about it. When I shut off my Tivo service, I told them that such a feature would entice me to keep it. But I seriously doubt they transmitted my idea to the right people.
Jan 31 2011
Ulrik Mikaelsson wrote:Of course, I don't know what HW the Tivo is using, perhaps they're just lazy. :)I thought that DSP's were programmable.
Jan 31 2011
I might be wrong, I hardly ever get to touch things that low-level, unfortunately. However, I think the DSP:s included in most STB:s are severely limited in how much you can twist them. AFAIU, that's one quiet important aspect of the whole HTML5 video-codec debacle. I.E. in the boxes I work with, the entire video-processing-chain is done in one pipe-line, separated from the CPU almost directly at the network-interface, and color-keyed back with other graphics in the very last rendering-step. (Much as the old Voodoo2-cards worked.)From the economics stand-point, there's a HUGE cost-focus on them, soevery chance of removing costs from hardware is taken. Every dollar saved on hardware is roughly a dollar on the bottom-line, and in the volumes STB:s sell, that's millions of dollars. Sure, software costs might go up, but not likely by millons of dollars yearly. I.E. even if you CAN use the DSP-components to post-process audio, I would not be surprised to learn it hasn't got the power to do it simultaneously with video-playback. Again, I don't work low-level enough to tell for sure, and TiVo might spend a lot more on the hardware than I'm used to, but hardware limitations in this industry is a very real challenge, especially for things like post-processing. I too would love 2X playback with working audio though. :) 2011/1/31 Walter Bright <newshound2 digitalmars.com>:Ulrik Mikaelsson wrote:Of course, I don't know what HW the Tivo is using, perhaps they're just lazy. :)I thought that DSP's were programmable.
Jan 31 2011
Ulrik Mikaelsson wrote:I might be wrong, I hardly ever get to touch things that low-level, unfortunately. However, I think the DSP:s included in most STB:s are severely limited in how much you can twist them. AFAIU, that's one quiet important aspect of the whole HTML5 video-codec debacle. I.E. in the boxes I work with, the entire video-processing-chain is done in one pipe-line, separated from the CPU almost directly at the network-interface, and color-keyed back with other graphics in the very last rendering-step. (Much as the old Voodoo2-cards worked.)The real money for Tivo is not the box cost, but the recurring subscription revenue. Even better if this idea is nontrivial to implement, as that would give the first mover an exclusive.From the economics stand-point, there's a HUGE cost-focus on them, soevery chance of removing costs from hardware is taken. Every dollar saved on hardware is roughly a dollar on the bottom-line, and in the volumes STB:s sell, that's millions of dollars. Sure, software costs might go up, but not likely by millons of dollars yearly. I.E. even if you CAN use the DSP-components to post-process audio, I would not be surprised to learn it hasn't got the power to do it simultaneously with video-playback. Again, I don't work low-level enough to tell for sure, and TiVo might spend a lot more on the hardware than I'm used to, but hardware limitations in this industry is a very real challenge, especially for things like post-processing. I too would love 2X playback with working audio though. :)
Jan 31 2011
"Ulrik Mikaelsson" <ulrik.mikaelsson gmail.com> wrote in message news:mailman.1098.1296493288.4748.digitalmars-d puremagic.com...Now, what we need is the audio-equivalent of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NcIJXTlugcThat's really cool, and seems so obvious in retrospect. . . . I bet it's patented.
Jan 31 2011
On 1/31/11 10:09 PM, Nick Sabalausky wrote:I bet it's patented.http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7873211.html, it seems to apply to video only though. David
Jan 31 2011
"David Nadlinger" <see klickverbot.at> wrote in message news:ii797m$13ir$1 digitalmars.com...On 1/31/11 10:09 PM, Nick Sabalausky wrote:It would have to be limited to video, the filing date is 2009 and this was presented at SIGGRAPH 2007. Jesus fuck, and they even *reference* that prior art in the very first "Other References"!! Gee, I wonder what douchebag owns this patent? Oh look, it's "Don't Be Evil" Google...Why am I not remotely surprised? (Hint: "publically traded corporation" together with "don't be evil" is complete fucking contradiction, by their very definitions. Always has been, always will be.)I bet it's patented.http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7873211.html, it seems to apply to video only though.
Jan 31 2011
Nick Sabalausky napisa=C5=82:There's a D implementation: http://dsource.org/projects/seamzgood but it's abandoned. --=20 TomekNow, what we need is the audio-equivalent of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3D6NcIJXTlugc =20=20 That's really cool, and seems so obvious in retrospect.
Jan 31 2011
Tomek S.:There's a D implementation: http://dsource.org/projects/seamzgood but it's abandoned.And it too has a vec2 and vec3! :-) http://dsource.org/projects/seamzgood/browser/trunk/util/geometry That's stuff for Phobos2. Bye, bearophile
Jan 31 2011
On 31/01/2011 17:01, Ulrik Mikaelsson wrote:Now, what we need is the audio-equivalent of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NcIJXTlugcDamn, pretty damn impressive! -- Bruno Medeiros - Software Engineer
Feb 10 2011