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digitalmars.D - mailing list vs news group

reply braddr puremagic.com writes:
Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came up was
newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be one vs
the other, but rather a gateway between the two.

The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.

Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway), would you
still use it?

For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a news
reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.

A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?
Feb 18 2006
next sibling parent Wang Zhen <nehzgnaw gmail.com> writes:
braddr puremagic.com wrote:
 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came up was
 newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be one vs
 the other, but rather a gateway between the two.
 
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.
 
 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway), would
you
 still use it?
 
 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a news
 reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.
 
 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?
 
 

No. NG is fine. I do wish the web version supported full-text search, though.
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent "Regan Heath" <regan netwin.co.nz> writes:
On Sat, 18 Feb 2006 08:53:44 +0000 (UTC), <braddr puremagic.com> wrote:
 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came  
 up was
 newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be  
 one vs
 the other, but rather a gateway between the two.

 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.

 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway),  
 would you still use it?

 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a  
 news reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.

 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?

No. I dont want to fill my mailbox, my news reader does threading and archiving and .. why would I want to use anything else :) That said, if you want a mailing list, there's no reason why we can't have one too. Regan
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent "Derek Parnell" <derek psych.ward> writes:
On Sat, 18 Feb 2006 19:53:44 +1100, <braddr puremagic.com> wrote:

 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came  
 up was
 newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be  
 one vs
 the other, but rather a gateway between the two.

 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.

 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway),  
 would you
 still use it?

 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a  
 news
 reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.

 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?

No thank you. The news reader is the best method of for me. -- Derek Parnell Melbourne, Australia
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent Kyle Furlong <kylefurlong gmail.com> writes:
braddr puremagic.com wrote:
 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came up was
 newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be one vs
 the other, but rather a gateway between the two.
 
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.
 
 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway), would
you
 still use it?
 
 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a news
 reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.
 
 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?
 
 

Feb 18 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent Gordon James Miller <gmiller bittwiddlers.com> writes:
braddr puremagic.com wrote:
 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came up was
 newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be one vs
 the other, but rather a gateway between the two.
 
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.
 
 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway), would
you
 still use it?
 
 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a news
 reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.
 
 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?
 
 

If there was a mailing list (or as you said, a gateway) I would most definitely use it, even if it was only one way. Having a digest ability would be fantastic.
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent Fredrik Olsson <peylow gmail.com> writes:
braddr puremagic.com skrev:
 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?
 

I prefer news groups. News groups works great for me, news was kind of invented for this purpose :).
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent "Charles" <noone nowhere.com> writes:
I've come to like the newsgroups , though I would join both :).

Charlie

<braddr puremagic.com> wrote in message
news:dt6nao$1l2d$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came up

 newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be

 the other, but rather a gateway between the two.

 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.

 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway),

 still use it?

 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a

 reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.

 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?

Feb 18 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent John Demme <me teqdruid.com> writes:
braddr puremagic.com wrote:

 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came up
 was
 newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be
 one vs the other, but rather a gateway between the two.
 
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.
 
 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway),
 would you still use it?
 
 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a
 news reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.
 
 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?

I'm pretty happy with the NG, but better searching ability would be nice... I wonder if someone could again persue getting the groups on google groups? ~John Demme
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent reply nick <nick.atamas gmail.com> writes:
braddr puremagic.com wrote:
 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came up was
 newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be one vs
 the other, but rather a gateway between the two.
 
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.
 
 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway), would
you
 still use it?
 
 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a news
 reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.
 
 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?
 
 

I would prefer a forum like PHPBB. I don't like how newsgroup thread-view indents things every time someone replies.
Feb 18 2006
parent reply Dawid =?UTF-8?B?Q2nEmcW8YXJraWV3aWN6?= <dawid.ciezarkiewicz gmail.com> writes:
nick wrote:
 I would prefer a forum like PHPBB.

<g> Yeah... great joke.
Feb 18 2006
next sibling parent nick <nick.atamas gmail.com> writes:
Dawid Ciężarkiewicz wrote:
 nick wrote:
 I would prefer a forum like PHPBB.

<g> Yeah... great joke.

No no, I really do like the web forum things. What's wrong with those?
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling parent reply Alexander Panek <alexander.panek brainsware.org> writes:
Dawid Ciężarkiewicz wrote:
 nick wrote:
 
I would prefer a forum like PHPBB.

<g> Yeah... great joke.

I don't get what's so funny about this. I also think a forum would be nice, but somehow I got used to this newsgroup alread, so I don't mind anymore. But in general, I'd prefer a forum OR a nice web interface for newsgroups (The one digitalmars uses isn't really the best, IMO). Regards, Alex
Feb 18 2006
next sibling parent reply "Walter Bright" <newshound digitalmars.com> writes:
"Alexander Panek" <alexander.panek brainsware.org> wrote in message 
news:dt7ok3$2ivn$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 But in general, I'd prefer a forum OR a nice web interface for newsgroups 
 (The one digitalmars uses isn't really the best, IMO).

It's not great, but it's been working reliably for several years, which in itself is a great feature <g>.
Feb 18 2006
next sibling parent reply Grzegorz Adam Hankiewicz <fake dont.use> writes:
The Sat, 18 Feb 2006 12:10:24 -0800, Walter Bright wrote:
 But in general, I'd prefer a forum OR a nice web interface for
 newsgroups (The one digitalmars uses isn't really the best, IMO).

It's not great, but it's been working reliably for several years, which in itself is a great feature <g>.

Stop working on D and use well known C/C++. Why improve?
Feb 18 2006
parent "Derek Parnell" <derek psych.ward> writes:
On Sun, 19 Feb 2006 08:58:04 +1100, Grzegorz Adam Hankiewicz  
<fake dont.use> wrote:

 The Sat, 18 Feb 2006 12:10:24 -0800, Walter Bright wrote:
 But in general, I'd prefer a forum OR a nice web interface for
 newsgroups (The one digitalmars uses isn't really the best, IMO).

It's not great, but it's been working reliably for several years, which in itself is a great feature <g>.

Stop working on D and use well known C/C++. Why improve?

Damn! You beat me to it <G> The DigitalMars Web interface to the newsgroup is a shining example of how not to design a GUI. Mind you, most of the HTML based list views are also poor UIs. -- Derek Parnell Melbourne, Australia
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling parent reply Alexander Panek <Alexander_member pathlink.com> writes:
In article <dt80n6$2qiu$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Walter Bright says...
"Alexander Panek" <alexander.panek brainsware.org> wrote in message 
news:dt7ok3$2ivn$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 But in general, I'd prefer a forum OR a nice web interface for newsgroups 
 (The one digitalmars uses isn't really the best, IMO).

It's not great, but it's been working reliably for several years, which in itself is a great feature <g>.

One long-term goal achieved, several short-term goals missed. :P Another question (quite OT, sorry): How's it coded? CGI? (Perl?, C?)
Feb 18 2006
parent "Walter Bright" <newshound digitalmars.com> writes:
"Alexander Panek" <Alexander_member pathlink.com> wrote in message 
news:dt8f2i$6d8$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 Another question (quite OT, sorry):
 How's it coded? CGI? (Perl?, C?)

I have no idea. Jan Knepper manages it.
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling parent reply Sean Kelly <sean f4.ca> writes:
Alexander Panek wrote:
 Dawid Ciężarkiewicz wrote:
 nick wrote:

 I would prefer a forum like PHPBB.

<g> Yeah... great joke.

I don't get what's so funny about this. I also think a forum would be nice, but somehow I got used to this newsgroup alread, so I don't mind anymore. But in general, I'd prefer a forum OR a nice web interface for newsgroups (The one digitalmars uses isn't really the best, IMO).

Try emailing Google to see if they'll add digitalmars.* to their list of groups. I emailed them once in the past but a few more emails would probably help. Sean
Feb 18 2006
parent reply "Walter Bright" <newshound digitalmars.com> writes:
"Sean Kelly" <sean f4.ca> wrote in message 
news:dt869c$300m$2 digitaldaemon.com...
 Try emailing Google to see if they'll add digitalmars.* to their list of 
 groups.  I emailed them once in the past but a few more emails would 
 probably help.

I have mixed feelings about Google adding digitalmars.*. One of the cons is that it would then become the target of spammers. The newsgroups here have been remarkably free of spam and other abuses. I'd hate to see that change. I'd prefer a comp.lang.d be set up.
Feb 18 2006
next sibling parent reply Ant <duitoolkit yahoo.ca> writes:
Walter Bright wrote:
 "Sean Kelly" <sean f4.ca> wrote in message 
 news:dt869c$300m$2 digitaldaemon.com...
 Try emailing Google to see if they'll add digitalmars.* to their list of 
 groups.  I emailed them once in the past but a few more emails would 
 probably help.

I have mixed feelings about Google adding digitalmars.*. One of the cons is that it would then become the target of spammers. The newsgroups here have been remarkably free of spam and other abuses. I'd hate to see that change. I'd prefer a comp.lang.d be set up.

my ISP discontinued usenet service as of Dec 15, 2005
Feb 19 2006
parent reply "Walter Bright" <newshound digitalmars.com> writes:
"Ant" <duitoolkit yahoo.ca> wrote in message 
news:dt9vkg$2ch4$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 my ISP discontinued usenet service as of Dec 15, 2005

All I can say is, whatever for?
Feb 19 2006
parent Ant <duitoolkit yahoo.ca> writes:
Walter Bright wrote:
 "Ant" <duitoolkit yahoo.ca> wrote in message 
 news:dt9vkg$2ch4$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 my ISP discontinued usenet service as of Dec 15, 2005

All I can say is, whatever for?

other ISPs cut the binary groups. (of course this is not the place to discuss the merit of that) Ant
Feb 19 2006
prev sibling parent reply Sean Kelly <sean f4.ca> writes:
Walter Bright wrote:
 "Sean Kelly" <sean f4.ca> wrote in message 
 news:dt869c$300m$2 digitaldaemon.com...
 Try emailing Google to see if they'll add digitalmars.* to their list of 
 groups.  I emailed them once in the past but a few more emails would 
 probably help.

I have mixed feelings about Google adding digitalmars.*. One of the cons is that it would then become the target of spammers. The newsgroups here have been remarkably free of spam and other abuses. I'd hate to see that change.

Good point. Really, I mostly like Google Groups for its searching capability. Otherwise, I'm very happy with Thunderbird as my DigitalMars usenet client.
 I'd prefer a comp.lang.d be set up. 

Aye, that might be nice. Sean
Feb 19 2006
parent "Walter Bright" <newshound digitalmars.com> writes:
"Sean Kelly" <sean f4.ca> wrote in message 
news:dtada5$2ph0$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 Good point.  Really, I mostly like Google Groups for its searching 
 capability.  Otherwise, I'm very happy with Thunderbird as my DigitalMars 
 usenet client.

Search is why I set up the newsgroup archives system. Ironically, it relies on google to do the actual search work <g>.
 I'd prefer a comp.lang.d be set up.


Yup.
Feb 20 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent reply "Jarrett Billingsley" <kb3ctd2 yahoo.com> writes:
<braddr puremagic.com> wrote in message 
news:dt6nao$1l2d$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.

Something even harder to follow and read than a newsgroup? Count me out. Hey, I have an idea. Let's just do away with the internet and use physical mail to communicate. Or telegraphs. Ooh, maybe smoke signals! Modern technology is so overrated. :P
Feb 18 2006
next sibling parent bobef <bobef lessequal.com> writes:
Jarrett Billingsley wrote:
 <braddr puremagic.com> wrote in message 
 news:dt6nao$1l2d$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.

Something even harder to follow and read than a newsgroup? Count me out. Hey, I have an idea. Let's just do away with the internet and use physical mail to communicate. Or telegraphs. Ooh, maybe smoke signals! Modern technology is so overrated. :P

This is what I think too. The news group is fine.
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling parent reply pragma <pragma_member pathlink.com> writes:
In article <dt7qh3$2kk1$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Jarrett Billingsley says...
<braddr puremagic.com> wrote in message 
news:dt6nao$1l2d$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.

Something even harder to follow and read than a newsgroup? Count me out. Hey, I have an idea. Let's just do away with the internet and use physical mail to communicate. Or telegraphs. Ooh, maybe smoke signals! Modern technology is so overrated. :P

*sigh* Time to drag out this old chestnut: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc1149.txt Enjoy! - Eric Anderton at yahoo
Feb 18 2006
next sibling parent "Jarrett Billingsley" <kb3ctd2 yahoo.com> writes:
"pragma" <pragma_member pathlink.com> wrote in message 
news:dt7r30$2l2i$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 *sigh* Time to drag out this old chestnut:

 http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc1149.txt

 Enjoy!

Hahaha :)
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling parent Lars Ivar Igesund <larsivar igesund.net> writes:
pragma wrote:

 In article <dt7qh3$2kk1$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Jarrett Billingsley says...
<braddr puremagic.com> wrote in message
news:dt6nao$1l2d$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.

Something even harder to follow and read than a newsgroup? Count me out. Hey, I have an idea. Let's just do away with the internet and use physical mail to communicate. Or telegraphs. Ooh, maybe smoke signals! Modern technology is so overrated. :P

*sigh* Time to drag out this old chestnut: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc1149.txt Enjoy! - Eric Anderton at yahoo

Heh, funny, but a little bit more seriously: I sat next to an old radio engineer at lunch at work, and he said that while short wave radios (radio amateur stuff) was more widely used, they had started testing a packet network using these radio masts along the Norwegian coast. They had some problems though, and was somewhat slow at a few bauds. What he thought was good about it though, compared to todays Wi-Fi and Wimax, was that it was directed and didn't litter all the space with radiowaves. He felt that that was a better engineering achievement.
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent Sean Kelly <sean f4.ca> writes:
braddr puremagic.com wrote:
 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came up was
 newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be one vs
 the other, but rather a gateway between the two.
 
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.

I would. I'm on a number of mailing list for various reasons and find them useful for more channeled discussions.
 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway), would
you
 still use it?

It depends on what information the list provided and if it was available any other way.
 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a news
 reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.
 
 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?

d.D gets a tremendous amount of traffic--I'm not sure I really want to get 100 additional emails a day. But for something a bit more specialized I'm all for it. Sean
Feb 18 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent clayasaurus <clayasaurus gmail.com> writes:
Newsgroup is good enough for me.

braddr puremagic.com wrote:
 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came up was
 newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be one vs
 the other, but rather a gateway between the two.
 
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.
 
 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway), would
you
 still use it?
 
 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a news
 reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.
 
 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?
 
 

Feb 18 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent "Ameer Armaly" <ameer_armaly hotmail.com> writes:
<braddr puremagic.com> wrote in message 
news:dt6nao$1l2d$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came up 
 was
 newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be 
 one vs
 the other, but rather a gateway between the two.

 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.

 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway), 
 would you
 still use it?

 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a 
 news
 reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.

 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?

 

Feb 18 2006
prev sibling next sibling parent Hasan Aljudy <hasan.aljudy gmail.com> writes:
braddr puremagic.com wrote:
 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that came up was
 newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it doesn't have to be one vs
 the other, but rather a gateway between the two.
 
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.
 
 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way gateway), would
you
 still use it?
 
 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web or a news
 reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.
 
 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via mail?
 
 

no man .. the NG is just fine, althu ideally I would prefer a more modern web-based forum package.
Feb 19 2006
prev sibling parent reply Georg Wrede <georg.wrede nospam.org> writes:
braddr puremagic.com wrote:
 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that
 came up was newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it
 doesn't have to be one vs the other, but rather a gateway between the
 two.
 
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.
 
 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way
 gateway), would you still use it?
 
 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web
 or a news reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.
 
 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via
 mail?

This could be implemented with a small Perl cron script on any machine outside digitalmars.com. Anybody with telnet access to an account could do this for the community in no time. As to whether it really is worth the effort, at least I wouldn't subscribe. Mozilla as a newsreader is good enough. Besides, I frequently switch between threaded, order-received, sorted-by-author, and various filtered views. Piece of cake. And I mark posts read or unread, and with various colors so I can reread them later if they are too long, or need background research before commenting on.
Feb 20 2006
next sibling parent Derek Parnell <derek psych.ward> writes:
On Tue, 21 Feb 2006 02:46:19 +0200, Georg Wrede wrote:

 Mozilla as a newsreader is good enough.
 
 Besides, I frequently switch between threaded, order-received, 
 sorted-by-author, and various filtered views. Piece of cake.
 And I mark posts read or unread, and with various colors so I can reread 
 them later if they are too long, or need background research before 
 commenting on.

Yes, a decent newsreader is a good asset. I use two, 40Tude Dialog and Opera. I prefer Dialog but Opera has a reasonable basic one. -- Derek (skype: derek.j.parnell) Melbourne, Australia "Down with mediocracy!" 21/02/2006 11:49:19 AM
Feb 20 2006
prev sibling parent Brad Roberts <braddr puremagic.com> writes:
On Tue, 21 Feb 2006, Georg Wrede wrote:

 Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 02:46:19 +0200
 From: Georg Wrede <georg.wrede nospam.org>
 Reply-To:
     "gatewayed mailing list for nntp://news.digitalmars.com/digitalmars.D"
     <digitalmars-d puremagic.com>
 To: digitalmars-d puremagic.com
 Newsgroups: digitalmars.D
 Subject: Re: mailing list vs news group
 
 braddr puremagic.com wrote:
 Walter and I were talking earlier today and one of the topics that
 came up was newsgroup vs mailing list.  The good news is that it
 doesn't have to be one vs the other, but rather a gateway between the
 two.
 
 The question:  Who would use the mailing list if it existed.
 
 Follow-up question: if the list was read-only (ie, a one way
 gateway), would you still use it?
 
 For myself, I'd prefer to receive mail rather than read via the web
 or a news reader, but I know I'm an odd duck at times.
 
 A show of hands.. want to be able to get each of the newsgroups via
 mail?

This could be implemented with a small Perl cron script on any machine outside digitalmars.com. Anybody with telnet access to an account could do this for the community in no time. As to whether it really is worth the effort, at least I wouldn't subscribe. Mozilla as a newsreader is good enough. Besides, I frequently switch between threaded, order-received, sorted-by-author, and various filtered views. Piece of cake. And I mark posts read or unread, and with various colors so I can reread them later if they are too long, or need background research before commenting on.

I'm well aware that it can be done by anyone. I was fishing for who was interested in having such a service. Since it's more than just me, though not a lot of hands were raised, I've gone ahead and setup several of the newsgroups as mailing lists. http://lists.puremagic.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ At the moment, they're news -> mail only. At the toggle of a radio button I can make them two way, but I figured one step at a time. These have been active since saturday, so there's a bit of mail in the archives already. Each of the lists can be received as digests for those that want it. Walter, feel free to put a link on your site if you want. Anyone, if you want any of the other groups hosted at news.digitalmars.com, just let me know. Later, Brad
Feb 20 2006