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D - So, how does D differ from Modula-3?

reply "Will Hartung" <willh msoft.com> writes:
I'm just curious, not being an expert in either, but at around the 5000 foot
view from above, they seem pretty darn similar, save for Modulas
LetCaptializeEverything idea.

So, if someone more informed could compare and contrast them, I think that
would be interesting.

/Will
Aug 16 2001
parent reply "Walter" <walter digitalmars.com> writes:
I don't know anything about modula 3.

"Will Hartung" <willh msoft.com> wrote in message
news:9lhdq9$1a7$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 I'm just curious, not being an expert in either, but at around the 5000

 view from above, they seem pretty darn similar, save for Modulas
 LetCaptializeEverything idea.

 So, if someone more informed could compare and contrast them, I think that
 would be interesting.

 /Will

Aug 16 2001
parent "Will Hartung" <willh msoft.com> writes:
"Walter" <walter digitalmars.com> wrote in message
news:9lhgq5$4t6$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 I don't know anything about modula 3.

There's a whole bunch at: http://www.research.compaq.com/SRC/modula-3/html/home.html Here's a small extract from: ftp://ftp.gte.com/pub/m3/linux-journal.html Introducing Modula-3 1.0 The Basics of the Modula-3 Language One of the principal goals for the Modula-3 language was to be simple and comprehensible, yet suitable for building large, robust, long-lived applications and systems. The language design process was one of consolidation and not innovation; that is, the goal was to consolidate ideas from several different languages, ideas that had proven useful for building large sophisticated systems. 1.1 Features of Modula-3 You can think of Modula-3 as starting with Pascal and re-inventing it to make it suitable for real systems develpment. Beginning with a Pascal-like base, features were integrated that were deemed necessary for writing real applications. These features fall roughly into two areas: those which make the language more suitable for structuring large systems; and those which make it possible to do "machine-level" programmming. Real application need both of these. 1.2 Supporting Large Systems Development There are several features in Modula-3 that support structuring of large systems. First is the separation of interface from implementation. This allows for system evolution as implementations evolve without affecting the clients of those interfaces; no one is dependent on *how* you implement something, only *what* you implement. As long as the *what* stays constant, the *how* can change as much as is needed. Secondly, it provides a simple single-inheritance object system. There is a fair amount of controversy over what the proper model for multiple inheritance (MI) is. I have built systems that use multiple-inheritance extensively and have implemented programming environments for a language that supportw MI. Experience has taught me that MI can complicate a language tremendously (both conceptually and in terms of implementation) and can also complicate applications. Modula-3 has a particularly simple definition of an object. In Modula-3, an object is a record on the heap with an associated method suite. The data fields of the object define the state and the method suite defines the behavior. The Modula-3 language allows the state of an object to be hidden in an implementation module with only the behavior visible in the iinterface. This is different than C++ where a class definition lists both the member data and member function. The C++ model reveals what is essentially private information (namely the state) to the entire world. With Modula-3 objects, what should be private can be really be private. One of the most important features in Modula-3 is garbage collection. Garbage collection really enables robust, long-lived systems. Without garbage collection, you need to define conventions about who owns a piece of storage. For instance, if I pass you a pointer to a structure, are you allowed to store that pointer somewhere? If so, who is responsible for deallocating the structure in the future? You or me? Programmers wind up adopting such conventions as the explicit use of reference counts to determine when it is safe to deallocate storage. Unfortunately, programmers are not very good about following conventions. The net result is that programs develop storage leaks or the same piece of storage is mistakenly used for two different purposes. Also, in error situations, it may be difficult to free the storage. In 'C', a 'longjmp' may cause storage to be lost if the procedure being unwound doesn't get a chance to clean up. Exception handling in C++ has the same problems. In general, it is very difficult to manually reclaim storage in the face of failure. Having garbage collection in the language removes all of these problems. Better yet, the garbage collector that is provided with SRC implementation of Modula-3 has excellent performance. It is the result of several years of production use and tuning. Most modern systems and applications have some flavor of asynchrony in them. Certainly all GUI-based applications are essentially asynchronous. Inputs to a GUI-based application are driven by the user. Multiprocess and multi-machine applications are essentially asynchronous as well. Given this, it is surprising that very few languages provide any support at all for managing concurrency. Instead, they "leave it up to the programmer". More often then not, programmers do this through the use of timers and signal handlers. While this approach suffices for fairly simple applications, it quickly falls apart as applications grow in complexity or when an application uses two different libraries, both of which try to implement concurrency in their own way. If you have ever programmed with Xt or Motif, then you are aware of the problems with nested event loops. There needs to be some standard mechanism for concurrency. Modula-3 provides such a standard interface for creating threads. In addition, the language itself includes support for managing locks. The standard libraries provided in the SRC implementation are all thread-safe. Trestle, which is a library providing an interface to X, is not only thread-safe, but itself uses threads to carry out long operations in the back ground. With a Trestle-based application, you can create a thread to carry out some potentially long-running operation in response to a mouse-button click. This thread runs in the background without tying up the user interface. It is a lot simpler and error prone than trying to accomplish the same thing with signal handlers and timers. Generic interfaces and modules are a key to reuse. One of the principal uses is in defining container types such as stacks, lists, and queues. They allow container objects to be independent of the type of entity contained. Thus, one needs to define only a single "Table" interface that is then instantiated to provide the needed kind of "Table", whether an integer table or a floating-point table or some other type of table is needed. Modula-3 generics are cleaner than C++ parameterized types, but provide much of the same flexibility. ---------- The major complaint someone may have is that it's descendant from Pascal and Modula versus C. Many also don't like the way it uses case sensitivity. But other than that, the bullet points seem to pretty much match 'D', save that you don't support generics. FYI and all. /Will
Aug 17 2001