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D - [Request] Last for a long time

reply Andrew Edwards <remove_ridimz remove_yahoo.com> writes:
How goes it? I'm wondering if anyone would be willing to spare a few 
minutes of their time to mentor an idiot.  I'd like to improve my 
programming skills but lack direction (I haven't the foggiest idea where 
to begin).

I've taken the liberty of downloading several open source projects and 
try to reimplement them as the author intended. But this never works as 
I get caught up in unanswered question as to why particular modules were 
used, where the author started, how he combined them to make the final 
product, what were the minimal requirements, and the list goes on...

I attempted the same with Ant's Leds editor and ran into the same 
problems. Basically I'm looking for a road map to guide me through any 
sizable project (just one will suffice). (I implemented this first, then 
this, then grouped them to gather using this, and finally I combined 
everything in the main program "which is:"). Or something similar.

If I'm asking too much please respond as follows:

  sorry.

no explanation required.

TIA,
Andrew
Feb 07 2004
next sibling parent "Matthew" <matthew.hat stlsoft.dot.org> writes:
It's sickeningly self-obsessed, but at the moment the only thing I've time
to suggest is that you read my "Positive Integration" column in CUJ, which
describes the design and implementation of recls, and its mapping to various
languages and technologies. The issues of concern are November 2003, January
2004, March 2004 (and I've just written the May 2004 one). I don't know if
you're a subscriber, but you can buy individual issues online.

Sorry I can't be more helpful at this time, but I'm just too squeezed.

All the best

Matthew



"Andrew Edwards" <remove_ridimz remove_yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:c03lor$14e9$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 How goes it? I'm wondering if anyone would be willing to spare a few
 minutes of their time to mentor an idiot.  I'd like to improve my
 programming skills but lack direction (I haven't the foggiest idea where
 to begin).

 I've taken the liberty of downloading several open source projects and
 try to reimplement them as the author intended. But this never works as
 I get caught up in unanswered question as to why particular modules were
 used, where the author started, how he combined them to make the final
 product, what were the minimal requirements, and the list goes on...

 I attempted the same with Ant's Leds editor and ran into the same
 problems. Basically I'm looking for a road map to guide me through any
 sizable project (just one will suffice). (I implemented this first, then
 this, then grouped them to gather using this, and finally I combined
 everything in the main program "which is:"). Or something similar.

 If I'm asking too much please respond as follows:

   sorry.

 no explanation required.

 TIA,
 Andrew

Feb 07 2004
prev sibling next sibling parent reply "C" <dont respond.com> writes:
You want a project to start ?  Everyone has their own learning style , but
what I usually do is pick something that I think is more than I am capable
of, and try to tackle it.  The first product probably wont be 100% , but u
learn how to do it , and you can perfect it in subsequent passes .

What about a Makefile generator , that accepts file names, and libraries on
the command line , and spits out the appropriate makefile ?

This might be a good starting point, and you can always ask questions in
here as they come up :)
C

"Andrew Edwards" <remove_ridimz remove_yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:c03lor$14e9$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 How goes it? I'm wondering if anyone would be willing to spare a few
 minutes of their time to mentor an idiot.  I'd like to improve my
 programming skills but lack direction (I haven't the foggiest idea where
 to begin).

 I've taken the liberty of downloading several open source projects and
 try to reimplement them as the author intended. But this never works as
 I get caught up in unanswered question as to why particular modules were
 used, where the author started, how he combined them to make the final
 product, what were the minimal requirements, and the list goes on...

 I attempted the same with Ant's Leds editor and ran into the same
 problems. Basically I'm looking for a road map to guide me through any
 sizable project (just one will suffice). (I implemented this first, then
 this, then grouped them to gather using this, and finally I combined
 everything in the main program "which is:"). Or something similar.

 If I'm asking too much please respond as follows:

   sorry.

 no explanation required.

 TIA,
 Andrew

Feb 07 2004
parent Andrew Edwards <remove_ridimz remove_yahoo.com> writes:
C wrote:

 You want a project to start ?  Everyone has their own learning style , but
 what I usually do is pick something that I think is more than I am capable
 of, and try to tackle it.  The first product probably wont be 100% , but u
 learn how to do it , and you can perfect it in subsequent passes .
 
 What about a Makefile generator , that accepts file names, and libraries on
 the command line , and spits out the appropriate makefile ?
 
 This might be a good starting point, and you can always ask questions in
 here as they come up :)
 C
 

I'll make this my second project, currently working on the clipboard suggestion from Matthew. Thanks, Andrew
Feb 08 2004
prev sibling next sibling parent reply J C Calvarese <jcc7 cox.net> writes:
Please don't take this the wrong way. I want to help.

Andrew Edwards wrote:
 How goes it? I'm wondering if anyone would be willing to spare a few 
 minutes of their time to mentor an idiot.  I'd like to improve my 
 programming skills but lack direction (I haven't the foggiest idea where 
 to begin).

What are your skills right now? We can't give your a direction if we don't know your current position.
 I've taken the liberty of downloading several open source projects and 
 try to reimplement them as the author intended. But this never works as 
 I get caught up in unanswered question as to why particular modules were 
 used, where the author started, how he combined them to make the final 
 product, what were the minimal requirements, and the list goes on...

Where are you trying to go? We can't give your directions if we don't the destination.
 I attempted the same with Ant's Leds editor and ran into the same 
 problems. Basically I'm looking for a road map to guide me through any 
 sizable project (just one will suffice). (I implemented this first, then 
 this, then grouped them to gather using this, and finally I combined 
 everything in the main program "which is:"). Or something similar.

I suspect each project of these proejcts has a different way of doing everything. I'm sure each of these large projects has a different goal. LEDS's purpose is to create a good editor for D in Linux. DUI's purpose is to create GTK+ apps in D. Windy's purpose is probably to facilitate Windows programming using native controls. What do you want to do?
 If I'm asking too much please respond as follows:

You're not asking too much; you're asking too little. :)
  sorry.
 
 no explanation required.
 
 TIA,
 Andrew

As as you probably already know (since I seem to mention this weekly), I've created some examples, http://jcc_7.tripod.com/d/tutor/. They're pretty simple (because I'm no D guru yet), but they might help a beginner. I try to add to them often and I know there needs to be a lot more commentary, but it's better than nothing. If you need something more sophisiticated, ask a specific question in this newsgroup. Many here know much. -- Justin http://jcc_7.tripod.com/d/
Feb 07 2004
next sibling parent Andrew Edwards <remove_ridimz remove_yahoo.com> writes:
J C Calvarese wrote:

<snip>
[good questions]
</snip

To which I will respond to soon.
Andrew
Feb 08 2004
prev sibling parent reply Andrew Edwards <remove_ridimz remove_yahoo.com> writes:
As promised: comments embedded.

J C Calvarese wrote:
 Please don't take this the wrong way. I want to help.

Don't worry about it. I asked for your advice and am prepared to accept and deal with whatever you can send my way.
 What are your skills right now?
 We can't give your a direction if we don't know your current position.

Apart from two C++ classes (Intro to Programming [1994] and Data Structures [2003]) I have no practical experience in programming. I am a logistician in the Marine Corps and my job does not include nor provide many opportunities programming. My programming accomplishments include a program that downloads and extracts a SFX file from the internet and compiling the Mersenne Twister RNG in D, hardly much to be proud of.
 Where are you trying to go?
 We can't give your directions if we don't the destination.
 

I am tying to gain practical programming experience. Maybe I should focus more on Operating System implementations because this is where I would like to do most of my work; However, I would like to gain some experience in building secure databases driven programs to assist in modernizing some of the archaic programs we continue to use in the Corps.
 What do you want to do?

Where do I want to go? My experience does not even allow for me to get on the path to my ultimate destination however I would like to implement my own Operating System. For now I'm simply trying to gain some programming experience.
 
 You're not asking too much; you're asking too little. :)
 

Wish I knew the appropriate questions to ask. I would be much more vigilant toward seeking answers. It can be a little disconcerting to seek advice about a subject which you are completely unfamiliar with. Hopefully with practice, experience will prevail.
 As as you probably already know (since I seem to mention this weekly), 
 I've created some examples, http://jcc_7.tripod.com/d/tutor/. They're 
 pretty simple (because I'm no D guru yet), but they might help a 
 beginner. I try to add to them often and I know there needs to be a lot 
 more commentary, but it's better than nothing.

I know and have used played with some of them. Thanks!
 If you need something more sophisiticated, ask a specific question in 
 this newsgroup. Many here know much.
 

Soon as I figure out what they are I'll be sure to ask. Andrew
Feb 14 2004
parent reply J C Calvarese <jcc7 cox.net> writes:
Andrew Edwards wrote:

 As promised: comments embedded.
 
 J C Calvarese wrote:
 
 Please don't take this the wrong way. I want to help.

Don't worry about it. I asked for your advice and am prepared to accept and deal with whatever you can send my way.
 What are your skills right now?
 We can't give your a direction if we don't know your current position.

Apart from two C++ classes (Intro to Programming [1994] and Data Structures [2003]) I have no practical experience in programming. I am a logistician in the Marine Corps and my job does not include nor provide many opportunities programming. My programming accomplishments include a program that downloads and extracts a SFX file from the internet and compiling the Mersenne Twister RNG in D, hardly much to be proud of.
 Where are you trying to go?
 We can't give your directions if we don't the destination.

I am tying to gain practical programming experience. Maybe I should focus more on Operating System implementations because this is where I would like to do most of my work; However, I would like to gain some experience in building secure databases driven programs to assist in modernizing some of the archaic programs we continue to use in the Corps.

Sounds like fun. I do a lot of database tasks in my job, but I haven't used D at work much yet. I'm not sure what you mean by "secure." Do you need something a lot more sophisticated than password protection? Do you happen to know if Access, MySQL, or sqlite have the proper security? I'm just curious -- we use MS Access and Oracle databases at my office. Since we use Access a lot at work, I've figured out how to do a number of things in ADO and DAO through VBA and VBScript, but D is quite different from VBA/VBScript. I've gotten a port of the ADO interfaces to compile, but I've run into fishy runtime errors. I recently figured out how to embed VBScript in D through a C DLL. It's kind of messy, but I think the concept has some potential. But there has to be an easier way... I've recently stumbled upon sqlite (http://sqlite.org ) and I think I might be able to do some cool stuff with it. It has a friendly license (public domain), also. Burton Radons developed some D bindings to work with it a while back (http://www.opend.org/sqlite/index.html). I've downloaded some related binaries the sqlite website and they seemed fairly usable to me.
 What do you want to do?

Where do I want to go? My experience does not even allow for me to get on the path to my ultimate destination however I would like to implement my own Operating System. For now I'm simply trying to gain some programming experience.
 You're not asking too much; you're asking too little. :)

Wish I knew the appropriate questions to ask. I would be much more vigilant toward seeking answers. It can be a little disconcerting to seek advice about a subject which you are completely unfamiliar with. Hopefully with practice, experience will prevail.
 As as you probably already know (since I seem to mention this weekly), 
 I've created some examples, http://jcc_7.tripod.com/d/tutor/. They're 
 pretty simple (because I'm no D guru yet), but they might help a 
 beginner. I try to add to them often and I know there needs to be a 
 lot more commentary, but it's better than nothing.

I know and have used played with some of them. Thanks!

I'm glad you could benefit from them.
 
 If you need something more sophisiticated, ask a specific question in 
 this newsgroup. Many here know much.

Soon as I figure out what they are I'll be sure to ask. Andrew

-- Justin http://jcc_7.tripod.com/d/
Feb 17 2004
parent reply Brad Anderson <brad sankaty.dot.com> writes:
J C Calvarese wrote:
 I've gotten a port of the ADO interfaces to 
 compile, but I've run into fishy runtime errors. 

Justin, How did you do this? Did you wrap the oledb or sqloledb header files? Do you think you have a path (via ADO) to MS SQL? Or is it that you have a path to ADO and ADO would need to be installed on the machine, but you'd be able to get to any ADO data source? In either case, good work. BA
Feb 17 2004
parent J C Calvarese <jcc7 cox.net> writes:
Brad Anderson wrote:
 J C Calvarese wrote:
 
 I've gotten a port of the ADO interfaces to compile, but I've run into 
 fishy runtime errors. 

Justin, How did you do this? Did you wrap the oledb or sqloledb header files? Do you think you have a path (via ADO) to MS SQL? Or is it that you have a path to ADO and ADO would need to be installed on the machine, but you'd be able to get to any ADO data source? In either case, good work. BA

The idea was to get access to ADO (and in turn, any ADO data source). ADO would have to be installed, but the latest versions of windows have it installed by default (Win2000/WinXP) and it's available as a free download from the Microsoft web page for earlier versions of windows. Unfortunately, I did something wrong in porting the header (msado15.idl?) and/or the C example. I was able to subdue the compile-time errors, but some runtime errors remained. I pushed the project to the side a while back, but I intend to work on it again sometime. If I got it to work, I'd probably also try to port ADOX and DAO. -- Justin http://jcc_7.tripod.com/d/
Feb 18 2004
prev sibling parent reply "Matthew" <matthew.hat stlsoft.dot.org> writes:
I've had an idea.

For a long time I've thought about writing a command-line application called
"clipboard", which would read from stdin and place the read-in content on
the clipboard.

One would then be able to do something like "grep -d stuff *.d | sort /+0 |
clipboard"

I think this would be of a suitable complexity, and would also be a great
tool to have in the D samples.

To start you off, here's a (C) function Clipboard_SetData(), that I use in
the shell extensions (http://shellext.com/)

    BOOL Clipboard_SetData(HWND hwnd, UINT fmt, HANDLE hMem)
    {
        BOOL    b = OpenClipboard(hwnd);

        if(b)
        {
            EmptyClipboard();

            b = SetClipboardData(fmt, hMem) != NULL;

            CloseClipboard();
        }

        return b;
    }

I'd suggest you work as follows:

1. A test program that uses the (D-adjusted) Clipboard_SetData with the
CF_TEXT format, and that simply places the command-line arguments on the
clipboard
2. The first proper version, which would read from stdin (using the std.file
stuff, I guess? I've not used any of that for a long time, so someone can
probably inform better)
3. A "smart" version, which can work with other clipboard formats.

Cheers

Matthew


"Andrew Edwards" <remove_ridimz remove_yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:c03lor$14e9$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 How goes it? I'm wondering if anyone would be willing to spare a few
 minutes of their time to mentor an idiot.  I'd like to improve my
 programming skills but lack direction (I haven't the foggiest idea where
 to begin).

 I've taken the liberty of downloading several open source projects and
 try to reimplement them as the author intended. But this never works as
 I get caught up in unanswered question as to why particular modules were
 used, where the author started, how he combined them to make the final
 product, what were the minimal requirements, and the list goes on...

 I attempted the same with Ant's Leds editor and ran into the same
 problems. Basically I'm looking for a road map to guide me through any
 sizable project (just one will suffice). (I implemented this first, then
 this, then grouped them to gather using this, and finally I combined
 everything in the main program "which is:"). Or something similar.

 If I'm asking too much please respond as follows:

   sorry.

 no explanation required.

 TIA,
 Andrew

Feb 07 2004
parent reply Andrew Edwards <remove_ridimz remove_yahoo.com> writes:
Matthew wrote:
 I've had an idea.
 
 For a long time I've thought about writing a command-line application called
 "clipboard", which would read from stdin and place the read-in content on
 the clipboard.
 
 One would then be able to do something like "grep -d stuff *.d | sort /+0 |
 clipboard"
 
 I think this would be of a suitable complexity, and would also be a great
 tool to have in the D samples.
 
 To start you off, here's a (C) function Clipboard_SetData(), that I use in
 the shell extensions (http://shellext.com/)
 
     BOOL Clipboard_SetData(HWND hwnd, UINT fmt, HANDLE hMem)
     {
         BOOL    b = OpenClipboard(hwnd);
 
         if(b)
         {
             EmptyClipboard();
 
             b = SetClipboardData(fmt, hMem) != NULL;
 
             CloseClipboard();
         }
 
         return b;
     }
 
 I'd suggest you work as follows:
 
 1. A test program that uses the (D-adjusted) Clipboard_SetData with the
 CF_TEXT format, and that simply places the command-line arguments on the
 clipboard
 2. The first proper version, which would read from stdin (using the std.file
 stuff, I guess? I've not used any of that for a long time, so someone can
 probably inform better)
 3. A "smart" version, which can work with other clipboard formats.
 
 Cheers
 
 Matthew
 

Cool, I'm on it! Quick question, I installed the shell extensions but it doesn't come with a grep implemantation. Know where I can find one already implemented for win32? If I understand correctly, each time Clipboard_SetData() executes, I should be able to go to the clipboard and see that new information there right? Is this the same clipboard as is associated with the office suite? If not how do I manually launch this particular clipboard to view it's content? For that matter, how would I launch clipboard without executing a member of the office suite? Thanks for the suggestions, Andrew
Feb 08 2004
next sibling parent Lars Ivar Igesund <larsivar igesund.net> writes:
Andrew Edwards wrote:
 Matthew wrote:
 
 I've had an idea.

 For a long time I've thought about writing a command-line application 
 called
 "clipboard", which would read from stdin and place the read-in content on
 the clipboard.

 One would then be able to do something like "grep -d stuff *.d | sort 
 /+0 |
 clipboard"

 I think this would be of a suitable complexity, and would also be a great
 tool to have in the D samples.

 To start you off, here's a (C) function Clipboard_SetData(), that I 
 use in
 the shell extensions (http://shellext.com/)

     BOOL Clipboard_SetData(HWND hwnd, UINT fmt, HANDLE hMem)
     {
         BOOL    b = OpenClipboard(hwnd);

         if(b)
         {
             EmptyClipboard();

             b = SetClipboardData(fmt, hMem) != NULL;

             CloseClipboard();
         }

         return b;
     }

 I'd suggest you work as follows:

 1. A test program that uses the (D-adjusted) Clipboard_SetData with the
 CF_TEXT format, and that simply places the command-line arguments on the
 clipboard
 2. The first proper version, which would read from stdin (using the 
 std.file
 stuff, I guess? I've not used any of that for a long time, so someone can
 probably inform better)
 3. A "smart" version, which can work with other clipboard formats.

 Cheers

 Matthew

Cool, I'm on it! Quick question, I installed the shell extensions but it doesn't come with a grep implemantation. Know where I can find one already implemented for win32?

Check the MinGW or Cygwin projects (I don't know where the source is though). Lars Ivar Igesund
Feb 08 2004
prev sibling next sibling parent "Matthew" <matthew.hat stlsoft.dot.org> writes:
"Andrew Edwards" <remove_ridimz remove_yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:c0696b$2b23$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 Matthew wrote:
 I've had an idea.

 For a long time I've thought about writing a command-line application


 "clipboard", which would read from stdin and place the read-in content


 the clipboard.

 One would then be able to do something like "grep -d stuff *.d | sort


 clipboard"

 I think this would be of a suitable complexity, and would also be a


 tool to have in the D samples.

 To start you off, here's a (C) function Clipboard_SetData(), that I use


 the shell extensions (http://shellext.com/)

     BOOL Clipboard_SetData(HWND hwnd, UINT fmt, HANDLE hMem)
     {
         BOOL    b = OpenClipboard(hwnd);

         if(b)
         {
             EmptyClipboard();

             b = SetClipboardData(fmt, hMem) != NULL;

             CloseClipboard();
         }

         return b;
     }

 I'd suggest you work as follows:

 1. A test program that uses the (D-adjusted) Clipboard_SetData with the
 CF_TEXT format, and that simply places the command-line arguments on the
 clipboard
 2. The first proper version, which would read from stdin (using the


 stuff, I guess? I've not used any of that for a long time, so someone


 probably inform better)
 3. A "smart" version, which can work with other clipboard formats.

 Cheers

 Matthew

Cool, I'm on it! Quick question, I installed the shell extensions but it doesn't come with a grep implemantation. Know where I can find one already implemented for win32?

AFAIK, on Win32 there's only one grep worth having, and that's Borland's. Download the C++ Compiler 5.5 Command Line Tools (somewhere on www.borland.com) and it comes with that.
 If I understand correctly, each time Clipboard_SetData() executes, I
 should be able to go to the clipboard and see that new information there
 right?

Right.
 Is this the same clipboard as is associated with the office suite?

There's only one clipboard per system, so yes. :)
 If
 not how do I manually launch this particular clipboard to view it's
 content? For that matter, how would I launch clipboard without executing
 a member of the office suite?

Feb 08 2004
prev sibling parent J Anderson <REMOVEanderson badmama.com.au> writes:
Andrew Edwards wrote:

 Cool, I'm on it!
 Quick question, I installed the shell extensions but it doesn't come 
 with a grep implemantation. Know where I can find one already 
 implemented for win32?

-- -Anderson: http://badmama.com.au/~anderson/
Feb 09 2004