www.digitalmars.com         C & C++   DMDScript  

D - ICFP 2003

reply "Daniel Yokomiso" <daniel_yokomiso yahoo.com.br> writes:
Hi,

    The ICFP 2003 is coming ( http://icfpcontest.org/ ), going from
2003-06-28 to 2003-06-30. Are people here interested in losing a weekend for
it. I know I am ;)
    As usual we have no idea about this year's task, but I think a team of 3
to 6 developers should be enough. Also if we give it a shot and get
ourselves a nice place we could get some attention for D.

    Best regards,
    Daniel Yokomiso.

"Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the
experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination
to do so."
- Douglas Adams, Last Chance to See


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.483 / Virus Database: 279 - Release Date: 19/5/2003
Jun 17 2003
next sibling parent reply prm <prm_member pathlink.com> writes:
what about Eon language
Jun 17 2003
parent "Daniel Yokomiso" <daniel_yokomiso yahoo.com.br> writes:
----- Original Message -----
From: "prm" <prm_member pathlink.com>
Newsgroups: D
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 2:23 AM
Subject: Re: ICFP 2003
 what about Eon language

Some day in the future, when it'll be finished and running. Today it's conceptual only. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.483 / Virus Database: 279 - Release Date: 19/5/2003
Jun 19 2003
prev sibling next sibling parent reply Helmut Leitner <leitner hls.via.at> writes:
Daniel Yokomiso wrote:
 
 Hi,
 
     The ICFP 2003 is coming ( http://icfpcontest.org/ ), going from
 2003-06-28 to 2003-06-30. Are people here interested in losing a weekend for
 it. I know I am ;)
     As usual we have no idea about this year's task, but I think a team of 3
 to 6 developers should be enough. Also if we give it a shot and get
 ourselves a nice place we could get some attention for D.

I don't feel quite up to the task of competitive D coding, but I could give support by - providing a CVS server (if needed) and - caring for test data - white box testing (if needed) within a max of about 10 hours total over the weekend. The CVS is under testing and might be available for other D projects too (if there is interest). -- Helmut Leitner leitner hls.via.at Graz, Austria www.hls-software.com
Jun 18 2003
parent "Daniel Yokomiso" <daniel_yokomiso yahoo.com.br> writes:
----- Original Message -----
From: "Helmut Leitner" <leitner hls.via.at>
Newsgroups: D
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 5:22 AM
Subject: Re: ICFP 2003
 Daniel Yokomiso wrote:
 Hi,

     The ICFP 2003 is coming ( http://icfpcontest.org/ ), going from
 2003-06-28 to 2003-06-30. Are people here interested in losing a weekend


 it. I know I am ;)
     As usual we have no idea about this year's task, but I think a team


 to 6 developers should be enough. Also if we give it a shot and get
 ourselves a nice place we could get some attention for D.

I don't feel quite up to the task of competitive D coding, but I could give support by - providing a CVS server (if needed) and - caring for test data - white box testing (if needed) within a max of about 10 hours total over the weekend.

I think this will be necessary, at least some kind of automated testing creation. They may post additional details during the competition, so it would be good to make unittests to cover the specs.
 The CVS is under testing and might be available for other D
 projects too (if there is interest).

 --
 Helmut Leitner    leitner hls.via.at
 Graz, Austria   www.hls-software.com

--- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.483 / Virus Database: 279 - Release Date: 19/5/2003
Jun 19 2003
prev sibling next sibling parent reply Burton Radons <loth users.sourceforge.net> writes:
Daniel Yokomiso wrote:
     The ICFP 2003 is coming ( http://icfpcontest.org/ ), going from
 2003-06-28 to 2003-06-30. Are people here interested in losing a weekend for
 it. I know I am ;)

I am. For CVS we could use either Helmut or OpenD.org; that could also be used for file storage if necessary. I also see a need for both instant (irc) and structured (news) collaboration. All devs should get synced to minimise potential jarring. The issues I can see are: - Sockets might be needed (this is implied by the rules). The only high-level sockets module I know of is the one in my urllib. - GUI tools might be needed. Again, the only one I know of blah de blah blah. I can release a new version that has a large increase in the amount of 3d math support and renders dedit nearly useable if that's desired. - Autodoc should definitely be a top issue with collaborative programming on what will remain a small source throughout the contest. I use Doxygen in conjunction with a filter packaged in dig. I don't see much that can be done beyond that; there's no common ground that I can detect year-to-year in the contests. The nightmare scenario is that the contest comes around and requires a module that we have no support for.
Jun 18 2003
next sibling parent reply Georg Wrede <Georg_member pathlink.com> writes:
In article <bcpe60$7s3$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Burton Radons says...
Daniel Yokomiso wrote:
     The ICFP 2003 is coming ( http://icfpcontest.org/ ), going from


I don't see much that can be done beyond that; there's no common ground 
that I can detect year-to-year in the contests.  The nightmare scenario 
is that the contest comes around and requires a module that we have no 
support for.

I got the impression that the program is going to do some output in tty format, which should then be emailed verbatim to them. That was not said, so this is my impression. We should have a team where thera are maybe three really fast programmers, and then another three who have a more theoretical or analytical bacground. All should be very creative people. Also, the communication during those 24 or 36 hours should be very fast, so in addition to mailing lists, we should use IRC. -------- I'll be on our annual sailing/bridge playing cruise with the boys, but I sure as hell will keep my fingers crossed for our team!!
Jun 18 2003
parent "Daniel Yokomiso" <daniel_yokomiso yahoo.com.br> writes:
"Georg Wrede" <Georg_member pathlink.com> escreveu na mensagem
news:bcppcc$ht2$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 In article <bcpe60$7s3$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Burton Radons says...
Daniel Yokomiso wrote:
     The ICFP 2003 is coming ( http://icfpcontest.org/ ), going from


I don't see much that can be done beyond that; there's no common ground
that I can detect year-to-year in the contests.  The nightmare scenario
is that the contest comes around and requires a module that we have no
support for.

I got the impression that the program is going to do some output in tty format, which should then be emailed verbatim to them. That was not said, so this is my impression.

I think they'll run some kind of network problem, reading data from their network and giving them back some results. But is just a guess.
 We should have a team where thera are maybe three really
 fast programmers, and then another three who have a
 more theoretical or analytical bacground. All should be
 very creative people.

 Also, the communication during those 24 or 36 hours
 should be very fast, so in addition to mailing lists,
 we should use IRC.

 --------

 I'll be on our annual sailing/bridge playing cruise with
 the boys, but I sure as hell will keep my fingers crossed
 for our team!!

Too bad :( As I read your message I thought you would be joining us. So far only two players in this game... --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.483 / Virus Database: 279 - Release Date: 19/5/2003
Jun 19 2003
prev sibling next sibling parent "Daniel Yokomiso" <daniel_yokomiso yahoo.com.br> writes:
----- Original Message -----
From: "Burton Radons" <loth users.sourceforge.net>
Newsgroups: D
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 7:19 AM
Subject: Re: ICFP 2003


 Daniel Yokomiso wrote:
     The ICFP 2003 is coming ( http://icfpcontest.org/ ), going from
 2003-06-28 to 2003-06-30. Are people here interested in losing a weekend


 it. I know I am ;)

I am. For CVS we could use either Helmut or OpenD.org; that could also be used for file storage if necessary. I also see a need for both instant (irc) and structured (news) collaboration.

Then we should set a D irc channel somewhere. I don't think people here would be angry if we use this newsgroup. Walter, are you ok with this?
 All devs should get synced to minimise potential jarring.  The issues I
 can see are:

cvs update every thirty seconds ;)
 - Sockets might be needed (this is implied by the rules).  The only
 high-level sockets module I know of is the one in my urllib.
 - GUI tools might be needed.  Again, the only one I know of blah de blah
 blah.  I can release a new version that has a large increase in the
 amount of 3d math support and renders dedit nearly useable if that's
 desired.

I agree with both. Fortunately we have a dig expert available ;)
 - Autodoc should definitely be a top issue with collaborative
 programming on what will remain a small source throughout the contest.
 I use Doxygen in conjunction with a filter packaged in dig.

Hmmm, I don't agree about this. I think that we should agree in some coding convention and create unittests. These are faster to produce and reveal intent. Documentation is good for apis but, as we have only 72 hours, they can become cumbersome to manage.
 I don't see much that can be done beyond that; there's no common ground
 that I can detect year-to-year in the contests.  The nightmare scenario
 is that the contest comes around and requires a module that we have no
 support for.

That's a possibility, but as we can link with C that shouldn't be a huge problem. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.483 / Virus Database: 279 - Release Date: 19/5/2003
Jun 19 2003
prev sibling parent reply Helmut Leitner <helmut.leitner chello.at> writes:
Burton Radons wrote:
 I am.  For CVS we could use either Helmut or OpenD.org; that could also
 be used for file storage if necessary.  

Do you want to create an open CVS space on OpenD.org ? If yes, the contest would be a good starting point. If no, I'd post the access data for my prowiki2.com CVS.
 I also see a need for both instant (irc) a

I've little chat experience. Please suggest a system so I can install and test it.
 and structured (news) collaboration.

I think this can be done here in a special thread. I'd also suggest (wiki) collaboration for - overall and individual task lists - overall design and documentation -- Helmut Leitner leitner hls.via.at Graz, Austria www.hls-software.com
Jun 21 2003
parent reply Georg Wrede <Georg_member pathlink.com> writes:
In article <3EF40CC8.4158BEBA chello.at>, Helmut Leitner says...

Burton Radons wrote:
 I am.  For CVS we could use either Helmut or OpenD.org; that could also
 be used for file storage if necessary.  

If yes, the contest would be a good starting point. If no, I'd post the access data for my prowiki2.com CVS.
 I also see a need for both instant (irc) a

so I can install and test it.

Check this: http://www.google.com/search?as_q=administer+easy&num=100&hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=irc+server&as_oq=quick+manage+Windows+Linux&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=i&as_filetype=&as_qdr=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=i&as_sitesearch=&safe=images ------- Helmut seems eager enough, how about the OpenD gang? I think we should decide right now, so that we have enought time to set it up, have everyone train using the wiki and cvs, and we also need the IRC channel right now. If we have access to a private server, then we can run a "private IRC", otherwise we can use any public IRC server, but then we need a bot to restrict everyone else from crowding the channel. The "private" would be easier, all we need is to download and start an IRC server somewhere. The privacy would be from nobody else knowing about the server or its address. Quick, effortless and easy. Servers for both Windows and Linux can be downloaded from a million places. Using IRC makes everyone feel they are talking in the same room, which is essential here.
I'd also suggest (wiki) collaboration for
   - overall and individual task lists 
   - overall design and documentation
Helmut Leitner    leitner hls.via.at   

Yes, all that you hang on the wall in the programmers' room should be on the wiki.
Jun 21 2003
parent reply Ilya Minkov <midiclub 8ung.at> writes:
Georg Wrede wrote:
 If we have access to a private server, then we can
 run a "private IRC", otherwise we can use any public
 IRC server, but then we need a bot to restrict everyone
 else from crowding the channel.

One doesn't need any bot. There have been 2 #D channels on different open IRC servers, and they had been announced here. 1 client parked, no person alive there. Simply noone is interested. Making the cannel invisible or requiering an invitation would be OK, any newcomer would simply need to knock on some existing member to get invited. -i.
Jun 25 2003
parent Georg Wrede <Georg_member pathlink.com> writes:
In article <bdd0q5$2roe$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Ilya Minkov says...
Making the cannel invisible or requiring an invitation would be OK, any 
newcomer would simply need to knock on some existing member to get invited.

I stand corrected. In this particular case, we are fighting against the others. Our ICFP 2003 group has to keep all its internal communication secret from the other groups, and that's why we need a secure channe. If this can be done without a bot, the better. (I'm too old to be an expert on IRC. :-( Overall, I think we do not yet have a sufficient mass to sustain an IRC channel on general D issues with on-going, round the clock communication. But the time will come. And, since we are well scattered globally, the future IRC channel may even be more evenly loaded than if it were a US-only channel.
Jun 25 2003
prev sibling parent reply "Nic Tiger" <tiger7 progtech.ru> writes:
I can join you.
What is required from me?

Nic Tiger.

"Daniel Yokomiso" <daniel_yokomiso yahoo.com.br> wrote in message
news:bcod1h$2b5o$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 Hi,

     The ICFP 2003 is coming ( http://icfpcontest.org/ ), going from
 2003-06-28 to 2003-06-30. Are people here interested in losing a weekend

 it. I know I am ;)
     As usual we have no idea about this year's task, but I think a team of

 to 6 developers should be enough. Also if we give it a shot and get
 ourselves a nice place we could get some attention for D.

     Best regards,
     Daniel Yokomiso.

 "Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from

 experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent

 to do so."
 - Douglas Adams, Last Chance to See


 ---
 Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
 Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
 Version: 6.0.483 / Virus Database: 279 - Release Date: 19/5/2003

Jun 19 2003
parent reply "Daniel Yokomiso" <daniel_yokomiso yahoo.com.br> writes:
"Nic Tiger" <tiger7 progtech.ru> escreveu na mensagem
news:bcsul9$h1h$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 I can join you.
 What is required from me?

 Nic Tiger.

The ICFP gives us 72 hours to complete the task, so if you can stay awake through the weekend is a plus ;) Seriously we need: capability to stay online through the weekend, desire to help improve D's status, hacking skills (i.e. ability to bang code fast, do quick prototyping, debug like a banshee and some optimizing skills for the last hours before shipping) and general programming knowledge (e.g. able to learn new things and implement them). Welcome to the team, so far it's me, you and Burton Radons. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.483 / Virus Database: 279 - Release Date: 19/5/2003
Jun 19 2003
next sibling parent "Andrew Edwards" <edwardsac spamfreeusa.com> writes:
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Daniel Yokomiso" <daniel_yokomiso yahoo.com.br>
Newsgroups: D
Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2003 8:55 PM
Subject: Re: ICFP 2003


 The ICFP gives us 72 hours to complete the task, so if you can stay awake
 through the weekend is a plus ;) Seriously we need: capability to stay
 online through the weekend, desire to help improve D's status, hacking
 skills (i.e. ability to bang code fast, do quick prototyping, debug like a
 banshee and some optimizing skills for the last hours before shipping) and
 general programming knowledge (e.g. able to learn new things and implement
 them). Welcome to the team, so far it's me, you and Burton Radons.

Too bad I can't join you on this one gang! I'm rooting for you though! Good luck! Andrew
Jun 19 2003
prev sibling parent reply Ilya Minkov <Ilya_member pathlink.com> writes:
I may also try to help out, but the problem is my beloved "sister" has got a
birthday on that saturday... besides, i'm not a very fast hacker... But else i
would try to help someway, esp. in the beginning. I want to see whether i can
gain some more people for that. So far i meet people, who are either Java fans,
or C++ fans, and are too hard to gain for anything else.

-i.

In article <bctljl$159l$1 digitaldaemon.com>, Daniel Yokomiso says...
The ICFP gives us 72 hours to complete the task, so if you can stay awake
through the weekend is a plus ;) Seriously we need: capability to stay
online through the weekend, desire to help improve D's status, hacking
skills (i.e. ability to bang code fast, do quick prototyping, debug like a
banshee and some optimizing skills for the last hours before shipping) and
general programming knowledge (e.g. able to learn new things and implement
them). Welcome to the team, so far it's me, you and Burton Radons.


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.483 / Virus Database: 279 - Release Date: 19/5/2003

Jun 20 2003
parent "Daniel Yokomiso" <daniel_yokomiso yahoo.com.br> writes:
"Ilya Minkov" <Ilya_member pathlink.com> escreveu na mensagem
news:bcufbo$1ruc$1 digitaldaemon.com...
 I may also try to help out, but the problem is my beloved "sister" has got

 birthday on that saturday... besides, i'm not a very fast hacker... But

 would try to help someway, esp. in the beginning. I want to see whether i

 gain some more people for that. So far i meet people, who are either Java

 or C++ fans, and are too hard to gain for anything else.

 -i.

Well if you only need to leave for something like 2 to 6 hours then it's ok. But if you need more time (e.g. travel time, organize the party, buy gifts) it may compromise the tight schedule. If we are around the globe, we'll have different timezones to deal with and maybe the party time will fall in some kind of covered hole (e.g. either other people will be available or everyone is sleeping). I don't know. If you think you can handle this you're welcome. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.491 / Virus Database: 290 - Release Date: 18/6/2003
Jun 20 2003